More Chrysler models on the chopping block?

GM_IV

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Also the Avalon's V6 has only 13 more horsepower than Chrysler's 3.5L Powertech V6.
Wrong. That is only if the 2GR-FE is given 87 octane fuel which new SAE regulations made them produce the number 268hp. Given higher octane fuel it would be the original number Toyota gave in 2005 which is 280 hp.

Might I add that Chryslers 3.5L V6 was first introduced in 1993, whereas the 3.5L V6 Toyota GR engine was introduced in 2002. So a 9 year gap between the engines and Toyota only managed to squeeze 13 more horsepower from their engine than Chryslers aging Powertech. Yea, real impressive alright.
Keep in mind, Toyota was using the 1MZ-FE during this time and the Chrysler engine your mentioning had only 214 hp with 3.5L vs a 3.0L Toyota used. In that case the difference was only oh give or take basically 20 hp. Another thing to keep in mind, fuel economy-wise the Toyota engine is a lot better. If Toyota wanted power, they could easily sacrifice the fuel economy but they didn't.
 
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Blind_Io

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Just because the 5.7L HEMI V8 was first introduced in the 2003 Dodge Ram does not mean it is a truck engine, incase you have forgotten, all HEMI engines of the muscle car era were in cars.

Also the Avalon's V6 has only 13 more horsepower than Chrysler's 3.5L Powertech V6.

Might I add that Chryslers 3.5L V6 was first introduced in 1993, whereas the 3.5L V6 Toyota GR engine was introduced in 2002. So a 9 year gap between the engines and Toyota only managed to squeeze 13 more horsepower from their engine than Chryslers aging Powertech. Yea, real impressive alright.

So what you are saying is that Toyota continues to develop and innovate and Chrysler hasn't progressed in their engine technology for the last 15 years. Gotcha.

Somehow the ability to put a 15 year old engine in a car does not impress me. That engine may have been impressive 15 years ago, but time marches on. If Chrysler fails to keep up then it's no one's fault but their own, they still have to compete with companies that innovate and progress; you don't get to turn back the clock and say the engine was great 15 years ago. It's 2008, get with the times.
 

thedguy

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Wrong. That is only if the 2GR-FE is given 87 octane fuel which new SAE regulations made them produce the number 268hp. Given higher octane fuel it would be the original number Toyota gave in 2005 which is 280 hp.

So what your saying is, it produces 268hp?
 

Mopar Man

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So what you are saying is that Toyota continues to develop and innovate and Chrysler hasn't progressed in their engine technology for the last 15 years. Gotcha.

Somehow the ability to put a 15 year old engine in a car does not impress me. That engine may have been impressive 15 years ago, but time marches on. If Chrysler fails to keep up then it's no one's fault but their own, they still have to compete with companies that innovate and progress; you don't get to turn back the clock and say the engine was great 15 years ago. It's 2008, get with the times.

No, what I am saying is I find it sad that Toyota's rather modern engine is still only marginally more powerful than a 15 year old Chrysler engine, and I don't think that's really anything to brag about.
 

GM_IV

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So what your saying is, it produces 268hp?
Thats the lowest hp it produces and only with 87 octane. The number Toyota lists for the Lexus ES350 is 272 hp for the exact same engine, but for some reason was allowed to list it this way(really confusing and I don't understand it). 268-280 is really the true number, it only varies with the fuel.
 

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Thats the lowest hp it produces and only with 87 octane. The number Toyota lists for the Lexus ES350 is 272 hp for the exact same engine, but for some reason was allowed to list it this way(really confusing and I don't understand it). 268-280 is really the true number, it only varies with the fuel.

Sometimes horsepower figures vary in different models even if it is the same engine. For example, the 5.7L HEMI Magnum V8 in the Ram trucks produce 345 horsepower, whereas in the Dodge Durango/Chrysler Aspen SUV's they only produce 330.
 

GM_IV

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Sometimes horsepower figures vary in different models even if it is the same engine. For example, the 5.7L HEMI Magnum V8 in the Ram trucks produce 345 horsepower, whereas in the Dodge Durango/Chrysler Aspen SUV's they only produce 330.
Sometimes if there was detuning or something else but in the case of the Camry V6, Avalon and ES350 there is no difference other than Toyota listing different numbers as if Lexus had some special status allowing it to list using 91 octane. Almost as if Toyota was intentionally intending to rip off ES350 buyers into thinking it was somehow better when its exactly the same.
 

thedguy

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Sometimes if there was detuning or something else but in the case of the Camry V6, Avalon and ES350 there is no difference other than Toyota listing different numbers as if Lexus had some special status allowing it to list using 91 octane. Almost as if Toyota was intentionally intending to rip off ES350 buyers into thinking it was somehow better when its exactly the same.

You sure they don't raise compression for the Lexus engines and require premium?
 

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No, what I am saying is I find it sad that Toyota's rather modern engine is still only marginally more powerful than a 15 year old Chrysler engine, and I don't think that's really anything to brag about.

More powerful, using less fuel, and it's attached to a much better car. You keep coming back to the engine but continue to ignore the chassis it's strapped to. The Toyota is a superior car when you consider the entire package instead of the few places the Chrysler might be marginally better (like having a V8, or RWD - both of which only appeal to a relatively small number of consumers for that class).
 

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This is true..
 

thedguy

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Toyota tends to concentrate on making it's engines lighter, less polluting, more fuel efficient, and reducing production costs. When they want a performance engine, they send a block over to Yamaha to build them a nice head/intake/exhaust header and/or turbocharge it.
 

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But Blind_Io keep in mind, if what you say is true about them "putting a truck engine in a car" we wouldn't have the Dodge Viper today now would we! ;)
 

Blind_Io

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... and if the rumors are true then we won't have it for much longer anyway.

Stop changing the subject (again). I was just being impressed by how you admitted Chrysler wasn't god's gift to roads and then you go and do that.
 

Mopar Man

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I'm JUST sayin..
 

Blind_Io

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*beats head on desk*

I've talked to walls that were more dynamic in their thinking than this... and less predictable.
 
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