Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting

Spectre said:
No, actually. He has the right to say what he wishes - but the rest of us have the right to disagree with him and ask him to go away. Further, he's here on a visa (I'd bet an H-1B employment visa), not as a naturalized citizen (and I'm not aware that he's even begun the process to do so) and therefore can be asked to leave for any or no reason whatsoever by the government.

It would be a violation of his rights if he were imprisoned for his statements by the government. It is not a violation of his rights to ask that he be made to go away for being offensive. Further, under the conditions of the visa he's here under, it's not a violation of his rights if he were to be returned to the UK for being offensive.

Of course, he's rather scared at the moment that an extradition warrant is going to show up from the UK and he really wants CNN's lawyers to be able to defend him.
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I would argue that deporting someone just for things they say would be in violation of the spirit of the first amendment. He says stupid ass shit but as it's not something that would qualify as hate speech it's not really grounds for kicking him out. I agree with ScarFace on this one though, he should be fired for being a shitty reporter. And of course as soon as he is fired we can deport his ass since his likely here on a work visa :p

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jmsprovan said:
While ex-military keep their guns, they do not keep military owned ammo. It is stored in government supply dumps. If you want to target shoot in Switzerland then you generally have to buy ammo at the range, very few people stockpile personal ammo at home.

It is a very poor comparison to the US in nearly every way.
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Point is not whether they own and keep government issued ammo or not but rather their attitude of guns = freedom and the fact that majority of the country decided that keeping guns at home was a right they were not willing to give up.
 
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Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting

prizrak said:
I would argue that deporting someone just for things they say would be in violation of the spirit of the first amendment. He says stupid ass shit but as it's not something that would qualify as hate speech it's not really grounds for kicking him out. I agree with ScarFace on this one though, he should be fired for being a shitty reporter.
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In which case he would also be deported. What's the difference? :p

It should also be pointed out that most countries do not allow people there on visas to criticize the government or the founding documents of the government while they are there. In Mexico, it is actually a crime to do so and they will throw you in jail THEN deport you, for example.
 
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Nocturnal said:
Please, please don't give him back. We don't want him.
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Where should we send him then? North Korea? Hell? Both of them are probably in the same ZIP/Post code, so the shipping will be about the same. :p
 
Spectre said:
In which case he would also be deported. What's the difference? :p
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The main difference to me would be that he wouldn't be deported for what he said but rather for his visa expiring. CNN being a private organization certainly has the right to do what they want.

It should also be pointed out that most countries do not allow people there on visas to criticize the government or the founding documents of the government while they are there. In Mexico, it is actually a crime to do so and they will throw you in jail THEN deport you, for example.
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As much as I like tacos I don't think we should base our legal system on Mexico :p

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ScarFace88 said:
Where should we send him then? North Korea? Hell? Both of them are probably in the same ZIP/Post code, so the shipping will be about the same. :p
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Send him to Bed-Stuy or Canarsie neighborhoods in Brooklyn and see how long he lasts w/o a gun :)
 
Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting

prizrak said:
The main difference to me would be that he wouldn't be deported for what he said but rather for his visa expiring. CNN being a private organization certainly has the right to do what they want.


As much as I like tacos I don't think we should base our legal system on Mexico :p
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No, just using them as an example. IIRC, the last time I got a visa for the UK, there was a note that my visa could be revoked for making seditious or critical statements of the government.
 
Spectre said:
No, just using them as an example. IIRC, the last time I got a visa for the UK, there was a note that my visa could be revoked for making seditious or critical statements of the government.
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We all know the UK is a "free" country. Also I didn't know you had to get a visa to go from the US to the UK or is it like going to any other European country where the "visa" is just stamped on arrival?
 
prizrak said:
We all know the UK is a "free" country. Also I didn't know you had to get a visa to go from the US to the UK or is it like going to any other European country where the "visa" is just stamped on arrival?
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Tourists don't need a visa to visit the UK, but if you are coming as part of a contract job or to do business (among other non-tourism related reasons), yes, you need a visa.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/view/visa.form
 
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Spectre said:
Tourists don't need a visa to visit the UK, but if you are coming as part of a contract job or to do business, yes, you need a visa.
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IIRC (It's been 11 years since I moved back to the states) you also need a visa if you are going to stay longer than a certain amount of time, I think it was 6 months.
 
Piers Morgan is a massive douchebag - but outside Britain and the USA he is virtually unknown. I personally came to know him only, because Jeremy Clarkson punched him in the face.

So for the rest of the he world he is a TV journalist, the follower of Larry King. Expelling him from the USA would result in an outcry and would create a disastrous picture in the rest of the world of the freedom of speech and freedom of press in America - not that I think some people here would be bothered really. But for a country, that files hard pornography under freedom of speech, a country, that's out to bring freedom to the world, this would be a moral declaration of bankruptcy.

Yes, he should have handled the situation better and not insulted the guy. But consider, how many right-wing morons can spread their poison and propaganda uncontrolled over the media there, without being reprimanded.
 
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I been watching some interviews he does and he is a complete and utter pillock. I have no problem with people arguing for stricter gun control policies as long as they make good points and understand what they talk about but that idiot....
 
jack_christie said:
That NRA guy was joke. How sick must he be to come out with an idiotic statement like that on the one week anniversary of the massacre.
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Which statement, specifically? The one about people being able to defend themselves everywhere but not in a school, where the lives of children are at stake too? Also, that guy is not from the NRA :p


jack_christie said:
http://www.channel4.com/news/piers-morgan-should-be-deported-demands-petition
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Penis Morgan said:
"If I do get deported from America for wanting fewer gun murders, are there any other countries that will have me?"
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:rolleyes: Having just watched the interview, that is clearly not the issue. I drive a Miata and even I don't like Penis!
 
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You gotta keep in mind that NRA is often seen as insane even by people who are all about guns, myself for example but I do want to dissect the top 10 statements:
1) Gun-free schools zones ?tell every insane killer in America that schools are their safest place to inflict maximum mayhem with minimum risk.?
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That makes logical sense, if you are going to go on a rampage you would likely choose a place with little chance of someone fighting back.
2) ?There exists in this country a callous, corrupt and corrupting shadow industry that sells, and sows, violence against its own people.
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I don't even know what that means but I got my tinfoil hat on!
3) ?[V]iolent crime is increasing again for the first time in 19 years! Add another hurricane, terrorist attack or some other natural or man-made disaster, and you?ve got a recipe for a national nightmare of violence and victimization.?
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If they mean the actual civil disorder arising from a disaster then yeah it makes sense that armed citizens can protect themselves when police isn't around, rest doesn't really tie into guns or gun control.
4) ?We need to have every single school in America immediately deploy a protection program proven to work ?and by that I mean armed security.?
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Pefect sense, my school had armed security and all the shootings would take place after school was let out never inside.
5) ?The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. Would you rather have your 911 call bring a good guy with a gun from a mile away ? or a minute away??
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There is merrit to this idea, plenty of cases of people defending themselves or someone else with a privately owned firearm. Police can't be everywhere at once and doesn't usually know of a crime until after the fact.
6) ?And throughout it all, too many in our national media ? their corporate owners ? and their stockholders ? act as silent enablers, if not complicit co-conspirators.?
7) ?Then there?s the blood-soaked slasher films like ?American Psycho? and ?Natural Born Killers? that are aired like propaganda loops on Splatterdays and every day, and a thousand music videos that portray life as a joke and murder as a way of life.?
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Good thing I already have my tinfoil hat on!
8) ?In a race to the bottom, media conglomerates compete with one another to shock, violate and offend every standard of civilized society by bringing an ever-more-toxic mix of reckless behavior and criminal cruelty into our homes ? every minute of every day of every month of every year.?
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This is true and has already been discussed, this is a side effect of capitalism bad news sells and that makes money for the news organizations.
9) ?Through vicious, violent video games with names like Bulletstorm, Grand Theft Auto, Mortal Kombat and Splatterhouse. And here?s one: it?s called Kindergarten Killers. It?s been online for 10 years. How come my research department could find it and all of yours either couldn?t or didn?t want anyone to know you had found it??
10) ?Isn?t fantasizing about killing people as a way to get your kicks really the filthiest form of pornography??
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Some more tin foil hattery and idiocy.

Sometimes I feel that NRA hurts the image of gun owners/enthusiasts more than any large scale massacre....
 
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2% of crime is mass shooting , maybe if it was not white ppl dyin it wouldn't be on the news...
Along with a state with a strict gun control.
 
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