Unveiled: The Teslerr Model 3

[GRtak]

That means that your car basically always has to be plugged in when not driven. Aside from the fact that it's not always possible, think typical inner city apartment dwellers, who likely don't have dedicated spots there is also the fact that people tend to be lazy and plugging something in takes more than 0 effort.

Either way it's largely irrelevant as any perceived need for large fixes tend to drag down prices on the used market. This is why manual cars tend to have a slightly higher resale value for higher mileage cars than autos, they are perceived to be cheaper to fix even though a well maintained auto likely will last as long as a well maintained manual (TC type only).

Now perhaps if the solid state batteries from the other thread are an actual practical reality we might have a completely different future but for Lithium the reality is that they do degrade over time and not an insignificant amount.

 

[Spectre]

-looks up and down his apartment complex lined street in Dallas-

-doesn't see any light or lamp posts-

Yeah, sorry, that's not going to fly in most US cities outside the usual high population density coastal suspects. And even then it's got some real problems - what if someone walking by is a dick and pulls the plug ten minutes after you plugged in and left for the night? Or cuts the cable, perhaps in search of copper to resell?

 

[GRtak]

If you would simply read the description, it tells you both ends lock in place.

 

[prizrak]

If you would simply read the description, it tells you both ends lock in place.

I can defeat that with a medium sized hammer... Or just cut the clearly unarmored cable.

Instant problems:
- Every light post has to be fitted with one
- Even on my street, there are way more cars than light posts
- It's a bigger pain than stopping off in a gas station.

 

[Spectre]

If you would simply read the description, it tells you both ends lock in place.

"Lock" in place, yeah. They're supposed to lock in place on other systems too - and many of them have been shown to be easily defeated without tools. As in, all you have to do is lean on the plastic handle hard and it breaks off, allowing someone to just rip the remains of the plug out.

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I can defeat that with a medium sized hammer... Or just cut the clearly unarmored cable.

Instant problems:
- Every light post has to be fitted with one
- Even on my street, there are way more cars than light posts
- It's a bigger pain than stopping off in a gas station.

Yup. Let's not forget that most American cities cut all power to light posts when it is light out and power to the posts is controlled by a central lighting controller for an area.

Also, apparently there's a big problem with 1. People hogging EV charge points even after charging is complete, 2. BEV drivers taking the charging cord out of plug in hybrids that are charging and plugging their vehicle in instead, justifying it with "but the hybrid has a gas motor to charge itself and I need it more), and 3. Charging up even when they don't actually need charging (so much for "range anxiety isn't real").

http://www.plugincars.com/eight-rules-electric-vehicle-etiquette-127513.html

 

[GRtak]

If you would watch the Damn video, it explains how it all works.

 

[Spectre]

If you would watch the Damn video, it explains how it all works.

Did watch the entire video. Ended up laughing my ass off at the naive assumptions made.

"We're not going to mark out a dedicated electric vehicle charging bay."
Well, even if you're putting three sockets/pole conversions in per person requesting, invariably the EV user is going to come back and find that all possible charging stations are in use or blocked. And as seen in the street, even if you convert every pole, you still won't have enough to serve even a third of the cars visible on the street, should their owners decide to replace them with EVs.

"All the tech is in the cable."
Okay, hacked versions that allow free charging available on eBay in three, two, one...

"It has an electronic lock."
That's nice. I notice there's no details given and that it still looks like plastic. I'm not seeing any security on that cable that couldn't be defeated or severely damaged by a simple kick. Leaving your EV plugged in overnight on a public street is an invitation to get your vehicle damaged. There's also no standard lock interface on the EV end.

 

[GRtak]

We've had ICEs around for 100 years and still deal with similar problems. What do you do when the gas stations close up at night? What do you do when your gas is stolen? What do you do when someone shoves something into your tailpipe?

No system is perfect.

 

[Spectre]

We've had ICEs around for 100 years and still deal with similar problems. What do you do when the gas stations close up at night? What do you do when your gas is stolen? What do you do when someone shoves something into your tailpipe?

No system is perfect.

ICE cars don't sit around on the street overnight with their fuel filler flaps open and a fuel hose dangling out of them, just asking for people to come along and vandalize their fueling system, though.

It takes more time and effort to steal gas from an ICE car and you can have hidden exhausts on it as well. It takes one good kick to break an EV's charge cable, so just a second. So you come out and not only is your car still discharged, your charging cable is fucked and you're not going anywhere.

 

[Spectre]

A similar case in point: http://www.greencarreports.com/news...ng-cord-cut-angry-neighbor-electric-car-hater

At 8 pm on Monday, February 3, their Volt activated its alarm and alerted the couple via mobile-phone app that its charging connection had been interrupted.

When Cummings investigated, he found that the cable of the charging cord had been severed--rendering it useless, and requiring the couple to buy a replacement at a list price of $450.

Soo, yeah, $450 a hit for a cut or smashed charging cable - get serially vandalized, pretty soon all your 'savings' from electric charging vice gasoline is quite gone.

Related reading: https://transportevolved.com/2014/0...c-car-charging-station-menace-copper-theives/
http://www.plugincars.com/why-balti...-stations-have-taken-too-long-fix-127614.html

Copper thievery is still a thing, and leaving a nice, big fat copper cable out in the open overnight? Yeah, you're asking for it.

 

[NooDle]

Why is everyone assuming that everyone else is just an asshole that hates EVs? Yeah, stuff like that may happen, but it won't be like a daily occurance.

Also, just get a garage and a charger like you're supposed to if you want to avoid that

 

[Spectre]

Why is everyone assuming that everyone else is just an asshole that hates EVs? Yeah, stuff like that may happen, but it won't be like a daily occurance.

I'm not assuming they'll be assholes who hate EVs. I'm assuming they'll be copper thieves and assholes who are just assholes and won't pass up an easy opportunity to play a prank or vandalize something.

I'm reasonably sure that most of the many people heaving Smart cars into canals in Holland don't actually hate Smarts specifically (though it is certainly a possibility) - they're just doing because they're dicks that think it's funny.

Police fear the bizarre trend will spread to the UK and the rest of Europe.

Eco-friendly Smart cars are small enough to be picked up by just a few people and dumped into the Dutch capital's canals, reports De Telegraaf newspaper.

One victim Casper de Jong was woken by police after they found his Smart floating in the waterway outside his apartment.

Mr de Jong said: "Several weeks ago the same thing happened to my companion's Smart. Both cars were a complete write-off."

Or the people in San Francisco flipping Smart ForTwos:

Someone's been vandalizing compact Smart cars in San Francisco, flipping the tiny vehicles on their front and rear ends in the city's streets.

NBC Bay Area found four of the targeted Smart cars between Sunday night and Monday morning. Two were found in the Bernal Heights neighborhood on Anderson Street, and another was found a bit south on Sweeny and Bowdoin streets, closer to the Portola district. They were either sitting on their headlights, rear bumpers high in the air, or vice versa.

Videos at link. Point is, there are people who will take any obvious opportunity and such unattended overnight charging is a very large opportunity indeed.

Also, just get a garage and a charger like you're supposed to if you want to avoid that

Many people in the cities these BEVs are best suited to do not have that as a realistic option. Hell, for that matter don't we have members in Germany that can't get electricity in the garages where they park even to get a battery maintainer or to run an electric tool?

 

[Dr_Grip]

 

[prizrak]

We've had ICEs around for 100 years and still deal with similar problems. What do you do when the gas stations close up at night? What do you do when your gas is stolen? What do you do when someone shoves something into your tailpipe?

No system is perfect.

There are gas stations that close at night? I have never seen that.... (I'm serious)

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Why is everyone assuming that everyone else is just an asshole that hates EVs? Yeah, stuff like that may happen, but it won't be like a daily occurance.

Because people are dicks, my X was broken into and rummaged through for valuables not that long ago and it was something a lot more involved to do than just cutting a nice big copper cable.
Or remember this case:
http://jalopnik.com/some-heartless-asshole-torched-a-disabled-kids-cherishe-1796946052

Many people in the cities these BEVs are best suited to do not have that as a realistic option. Hell, for that matter don't we have members in Germany that can't get electricity in the garages where they park even to get a battery maintainer or to run an electric tool?

Adding to that, even with off the street parking EV chargers may not be a realistic option. For example where I live the parking lot is behind the building and my apartment is on the opposite side. There is no easy way to run the wiring for my car, can't even drill through walls since the apt on that side is a duplex (fist floor with a basement).

 

[JCE]

Offtopic, I hope they find out who torched that awesome Mach 1 as to draw and quarter them on live (internet) TV. Taking the kid or suspicions people are having with the story aside, a fucking awesome Mach 1 was destroyed. That hurts inside... Especially because that exact paint scheme, engine, and pretty much the whole car is my dream Mustang.

 

[AiR]

My guess: a button inside the door handle.

Yes I suppose so. But what if there's no electricity?

Is the owners manual up anywhere yet? This is very important

 

[Chibouki]

Lots of people here sounds like Kodak ceo's when numeric photography happened. We know how it turned out.

 

[NecroJoe]

For what it's worth, we have a car charger on the outside of our house. We live on a dead-end street that ends at the back side of a school parking lot, which means hundreds of people walking through twice a day and most are kids. We've had it for 2 years now, and so far nothing's happened.

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Lots of people here sounds like Kodak ceo's when numeric photography happened. We know how it turned out.

And just like with digital photography, there are still purists and enthusiasts that shoot film, and there's a small but dedicated industry to support it. A friend of mine has been shooting digital since the first digital Rebel, and I helped him shoot with his Mamiya medium format film camera over the weekend. Probably a pretty good parallel to where the car will end up.

 

[Chibouki]

And just like with digital photography, there are still purists and enthusiasts that shoot film, and there's a small but dedicated industry to support it. A friend of mine has been shooting digital since the first digital Rebel, and I helped him shoot with his Mamiya medium format film camera over the weekend. Probably a pretty good parallel to where the car will end up.

Yep, exactly.

 

[Cellos88GT]

Lots of people here sounds like Kodak ceo's when numeric photography happened. We know how it turned out.

I just don't believe pure EVs are the way to go, plug-in hybrids are vastly superior and far more flexible. The next best option are fuel cells. Li-Ion BEVs are a short-sighted measure and the economics of Lithium globally, do not add up to work in the favor of mass market EVs.