The Trump Presidency - how I stopped worrying and learned to love the Hair

Cellos88GT

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In other news, Trump is getting triggered by what some professional sports player think of him. What a little bitch. :rofl:
 

TC

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Amazing that people still don't understand what the problem was with that. They can have personal accounts, but not for classified material.
 

PelicanHazard

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Amazing that people still don't understand what the problem was with that. They can have personal accounts, but not for classified material.
Let the record show that you were the one to bring up classified material.

Skip that somewhat sparse article, click through to the original Politico article, and you'll find this:

Politico said:
Presidential son-in-law and senior adviser Jared Kushner has corresponded with other administration officials about White House matters through a private email account set up during the transition last December, part of a larger pattern of Trump administration aides using personal email accounts for government business.

...

People familiar with the account say it was primarily set up for Kushner?s personal communications, but he has used it to communicate with acquaintances outside the White House about matters relating to Trump and the administration, according to people who have received messages, as well as with his White House colleagues.

...

Private email traffic among White House aides ? some of it sent between personal email accounts rather than to or from government addresses ? could skirt the requirements of the Presidential Records Act, which requires all documents related to the president?s personal and political activities to be archived.

Lowell said Kushner has adhered to government record-keeping requirements by forwarding all the emails to his account, though POLITICO could not verify that.

Other White House officials have also sometimes used personal accounts to correspond with Kushner and with each other, according to emails seen by POLITICO and people familiar with Kushner?s correspondence. They have also used encrypted apps like Signal and Confide that automatically delete messages, prompting former press secretary Sean Spicer in February to issue a warning to communications staffers that using such apps could violate the Presidential Records Act.
Now, whether you think that such things don't really matter and only confidential material does, it's still part of the law, as National Review succinctly pointed out for Clinton:

National Review said:
The Federal Records Act requires the preservation of any official ?record,? which is defined functionally to require preservation whenever a record relates to the performance of a federal official?s duties.

...

There is also little doubt, given this functional definition, that e-mail has been covered by the Federal Records Act since its adoption by the federal government during the Clinton administration.

...

So was the use of private e-mail allowed when Clinton was secretary? Well, sure, at least to some extent. I suspect every federal employee has, at some time, used a private e-mail account to conduct business. But that doesn?t excuse failure to comply with the Federal Records Act. Best practices have always been that an employee using a private account for government business has to either print the e-mail (which rarely happens) or copy or forward the e-mail to the employee?s official government e-mail account for preservation. Those practices, which reflected the law as it existed before Mrs. Clinton was secretary of state, were codified by National Archives Regulations in 2009, which required that any records created on private e-mail accounts must be saved to the federal-records system. And Congress confirmed that in 2013, by adopting a prohibition on the use of private e-mail, unless the employee forwards to or copies an official e-mail account within 60 days of the record?s creation.
Yes yes, one says Presidential Records Act and the other says Federal. Similar Acts, just one covers the presidency and the other one the rest of the government.

So, the concern is that he's skirting the law governing records retention, not classified material. Though the way the media's been 1-2 punching, I wouldn't be surprised to wake up to an alert tomorrow that Kushner was indeed handling classified material through that email. I doubt it, though. As I doubt that we'll hear more of this. Maybe Politico just couldn't get verification and everything is indeed being retained, maybe it's not, but it's quite likely to be forgotten to the side as all the morning shows and water cooler talks tomorrow focus on the NFL players' acts today, and then something else will come up later in the week. Maybe Kim Jong Un updates his Korean-English dictionary and issues more statements. Who knows.
 

PelicanHazard

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1) You're kidding yourself if you think that Democrats aren't all giddy with the thought of getting back at the Republicans over a Clinton-esque email scandal.
2) You're kidding yourself if think that this is remotely as big of a deal as Clinton's email scandal.
1] Internet commenters are not party leadership. You yourself say it's not Clinton-esque, why would the Dems on the Hill? Besides, where are the Dems calling for Kushner to be locked up? The worst I've seen them say is that he should have his security clearance revoked, but that's an old news item related to his 'forgetfulness'; Kushner's revised his SF-86, what, three times now?
2] I don't. Observe:

So, the concern is that he's skirting the law governing records retention, not classified material. Though the way the media's been 1-2 punching, I wouldn't be surprised to wake up to an alert tomorrow that Kushner was indeed handling classified material through that email. I doubt it, though.
It's an amusing story of the "Emails!" camp getting found out to also be questionably following retention Acts (hence Spicer's warning in February). Nothing more, unless something else breaks.
 

TC

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If Kushner isn't complying with retention rules, that's fine, but the simple fact that he uses a personal account and even encryption doesn't prove that. They are allowed to use such things under the law.

The issue with Clinton was the negligent handling of classified material. Which is a felony. The fact that she used a personal email account for it is hardly important, but it seems people want to muddy the water and focus on that one detail, as if it is actually relevant. In addition to using her unsecured personal email server for classified material, Clinton also forwarded such material to her aid, Huma Abedin, who then also forwarded it to her husband Anthony Weiner, neither of which had clearance to view such material. The blatant negligence is shocking, but people try desperately to find any Republican who uses a personal email account inorder to create a false equivalence.

For the record, it would not surprise me in the slightest if many people in our government were in violation of such rules and laws. On both sides of the aisle. I've never had much faith in their competence or integrity. It's simply disgraceful that people try to use non-stories such as this to excuse Clinton's actual crimes.
 

Cellos88GT

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For the record, it would not surprise me in the slightest if many people in our government were in violation of such rules and laws. On both sides of the aisle. I've never had much faith in their competence or integrity. It's simply disgraceful that people try to use non-stories such as this to excuse Clinton's actual crimes.
In my experience, there are a number of gov't employees working on ITAR restricted projects that violate this rule. I don't think people do it intentionally more so it is a consequence of the digital age we live in. Mind you this doesn't excuse Hillary's blatant abuse of this.

- - - Updated - - -

Speaking of Hillary, remember one of her primary campaign staffers, Huma Abedin? Well, her husband Anthony Weiner just got sentenced to prison for sexting a teenager. Interesting how Hillary was so creeped out by Trump on stage but not by her rapey husband or Huma's pedo husband.
Here's the rub: Weiner know's he has a problem, Trump doesn't.
 

Racin

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Speaking of Hillary, remember one of her primary campaign staffers, Huma Abedin? Well, her husband Anthony Weiner just got sentenced to prison for sexting a teenager. Interesting how Hillary was so creeped out by Trump on stage but not by her rapey husband or Huma's pedo husband.
Trump is the President. Not the husband of a campaign staffer.
 

GRtak

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Any thoughts on Trumps conflict with the NFL?


I sum it up as Trump overcompensating and trying to keep his base's support.
 

TC

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Any thoughts on Trumps conflict with the NFL?


I sum it up as Trump overcompensating and trying to keep his base's support.
Personally, I think it's just another distraction from real issues. And it's kind of sad how so many have fallen into it, inadvertently making themselves look anti-American, which isn't going to impress anyone that isn't already on their side. In their attempts to snub Trump, they're being manipulated into snubbing America. Whether they realize it or not, that's exactly what it looks like. Snubbing symbols of our country that have nothing to do with Trump.

Of course, I don't think that was Trump's plan. I think he was just mouthing off as usual. There was probably a Colin Kaepernick story on Fox News that day, or something.
 

_HighVoltage_

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Cliffs: NFL ratings are falling because a bunch of rich dudes that get paid to entertain us are throwing a tantrum and disrespecting the flag, the country, and the armed forces and fans don't like it.
Wrong. They are not your gladiators, and there is nothing in their employment contracts that constrains them to just entertaining us.

Personally, I think it's just another distraction from real issues. And it's kind of sad how so many have fallen into it, inadvertently making themselves look anti-American, which isn't going to impress anyone that isn't already on their side. In their attempts to snub Trump, they're being manipulated into snubbing America. Whether they realize it or not, that's exactly what it looks like. Snubbing symbols of our country that have nothing to do with Trump.

Of course, I don't think that was Trump's plan. I think he was just mouthing off as usual. There was probably a Colin Kaepernick story on Fox News that day, or something.
That's a better summary. But it has to be stressed that they didn't protest the flag, they protested someone telling them they should salute it or they will get fired. But you are right, to most people who ignored the context, it looked like they snubbed the flag.

"I love burgers. I eat them for lunch every day. But if my employer tells me I have to love burgers, or he will fire me, that will piss me off. I will refuse to eat the burger. But it's not that I no longer love the burger. I just don't want to be told to love it."

Trump can use rhetoric to persuade me of all the reasons why I should respect the flag. He crosses a line when he tells me I have to salute it because if I don't he will fire me. That's coercion, not patriotism.
 

prizrak

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Wrong. They are not your gladiators, and there is nothing in their employment contracts that constrains them to just entertaining us.
Umm... yes they literally are. They very specifically get paid in order to get hurt and hurt for our entertainment. Their opinion matters no more or less than yours or mine and they can express it at the polls. I don't watch sports or care either way but many people do and many of them simply don't want to see politics in their entertainment but just want to relax, this is the main reason NFL is getting all this flack.
 
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