Ownership Verified: The wait was long enough: leviathan's Tesla Model 3 Performance

Matt2000

An Unfortunate Discovery
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Gee, it's almost as if you as the driver have to pay attention and drive the car!
Can't tell if sarcasm or if you're missing the point a bit. :p

These features are part of the self-driving beta so will eventually have to work without the driver (whether you like it or not they won't be abandoning the idea now). Them failing is part of the development but we have to test them if we are going to contribute towards the software development.
 

93Flareside

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My experience so far: the sign reading works ok-ish. It does mostly read the signs correctly, if it does!

Problem 1: it's disabled on the Autobahn. That's literally the place I would want it most. Any other place, it's just not useful to me... may be a German or personal problem though. Doubly worse: my regular stretch of Autobahn has LED overhead speed limit signs that get set according to the current situation. Those it can't read anyway, but instead interprets them as traffic lights sometimes! ON THE AUTOBAHN! FFS there can't be traffic lights on the autobahn... and the car knows it's on the AB because it refuses to read the speed limit signs! Sadly a bit typical of the "Beta" state of these features...

Problem 2: it's not predictive enough... meaning it doesn't look far enough ahead. It'll only read the sign and act accordingly the moment you actually blow past the sign. That's simply too late and I feel results in too harsh of a reaction (both de- and acceleration).

Problem 3: Some sign's it just refuses to see and then doesn't fall back to map data or whatever. I've had the occasional B-road drive where a 70 limit gets lifted after a crossroads... but the car just won't see it! means i'm stuck at 70, because AP will not allow me to freely set the target! At least not if I also want to have it read the limit signs. This really is annoying as shit...
I have first hand experience with a Ford S-Max, I can safely say it could read the LED speed limit signs, and has radar cruise control. Closeenough.jpg 😝
 

leviathan

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Yeah, several cars I've driven before have had what appears to be nearly perfectly reliable speed limit sign recognition, including highways and LED/dynamically changing signs. Combined with ACC it makes cruising on the highway really pleasant - just needs Tesla's AP autosteer to be perfect :) I hope the capability to read and apply those comes to the Tesla software sooner rather than later.
 

eizbaer

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I have to admit that I haven't had my car mistake the overhead LED limits for a traffic light for a while... they may have patched that away already :D But that was openly speaking straight dangerous... because going at 130+ km/h and the car thinking it's supposed to slow you to a full stop in 200m is not a great idea.
It honestly works fine most of the time, it's just that in certain situations it doesn't - and those kinda ruin the experience. Also I wish they would just add the option to automatically adjust to speed limits but allow me to overwrite the target speed at any time (that way I could just correct the lifted limit if it misses it). Currently it's just one or the other for some reason.
 

leviathan

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Help, my car is being disassembled!

IMG_0870.jpeg


Oh, wait, it's just the service ranger. Quite an awesome service offering imho - I don't need to take time off and go to the service center and wait around until the car is done, and Tesla saves actual service center capacity for more serious issues that need lifts and other equipment only available there.

So, the FSD computer upgrade is in. Took a couple hours, and the car needed to be taken apart a lot more than I thought - as can be seen. All settings and data were backed up and restored afterwards, only a few items are lost and need to be re-configured (Wifi access points, Bluetooth for the phone, and most annoyingly the trip meters are all gone). All in all, quite a smooth experience.

IMG_0871.jpeg


But wait, there's more! This being Tesla, I fully expected something to go wrong, and... well, wasn't disappointed. Or was, I'm still not sure.

After the ranger set off, I fiddled around with the menus for a moment, then realized it won't do much until I take it on a longer-ish calibration drive (needs ~20km to self-calibrate all cameras on the new hardware, before all the AP stuff becomes available again), and set off. Then realized it's still the middle of the day and I actually need to get back to work - so quickly came back, parked the car, and wanted to get something out of the glovebox.

Which wouldn't open.

For those who don't know - the glovebox in the Model 3 has no actual handle. It's opened by an actuator, controlled by a button on the screen. Which I pressed, and instead of the usual "click" and the glovebox slowly dropping open, heard a weird short electric "bzz" noise from the general area.

Troubleshooting time! Knock on the glovebox cover a few times - no effect. Try actuating it while pushing on it - no effect. Reset the screen and try again ("Hello, IT, have you tried turning it off and on again?") - no effect.

Ok, fuck this. Called Tesla, to their credit only took me about 3 minutes to get through to an actual person in the service center. Explained the problem. They called the ranger dude, he didn't really get far yet - came back half an hour later, and diagnosed the problem after taking half the dash apart again.

Apparently Tesla uses a ton of the same exact plug for many, many functions of the car - lights, some of the speakers, some actuators. Among those are the glovebox actuator, and the backup speaker that sits below the glovebox and is used for various alert sounds when the main speakers can't be used for some reason (for example, if the screen has crashed and is rebooting - which doesn't really happen much at all, but apparently was enough of a concern for a backup hardware solution to be in place? idk). Which he apparently swapped during reassembly after installing the FSD computer, which sits behind the glovebox.

Thankfully, once diagnosed, the fix took all of 5 minutes. Thanked him for his time, and he took off again. I decided that I'm not going back to work again at this point, and took off on a longer test drive to make sure the rest of the car actually all works :D

From what I can tell, it does. The camera calibration took about 15km, and after that the left side of my screen shows a ton more stuff than before: lane markings now include any arrows painted in the lane, there's stop signs, speed signs, traffic lines and stopping lines, cones, posts, trash bins... the stuff it has seen before (other cars/bikes/people, lane markings) seems to also be a bit smoother. Reversing and side cameras show up much faster when opened (sometimes took a couple seconds to render on the old hardware, and the side cameras always took a moment after the "main" one - now it's all pretty much instantaneous), and the image processing is better, so the picture of all 3 cameras appears to be a better quality than before. Dashcam/Sentry recordings should be better now, too - need to make a couple tests some time later. Halting at stop signs and lights works as promised. Not yet sure I'll keep that activated though, need to test it a bit more - you _do_ need to confirm every green light to be green, or it will slow down and stop as if it were red when Autopilot is active, which may become tedious after a while.
 

93Flareside

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Help, my car is being disassembled!

View attachment 3560949

Oh, wait, it's just the service ranger. Quite an awesome service offering imho - I don't need to take time off and go to the service center and wait around until the car is done, and Tesla saves actual service center capacity for more serious issues that need lifts and other equipment only available there.

So, the FSD computer upgrade is in. Took a couple hours, and the car needed to be taken apart a lot more than I thought - as can be seen. All settings and data were backed up and restored afterwards, only a few items are lost and need to be re-configured (Wifi access points, Bluetooth for the phone, and most annoyingly the trip meters are all gone). All in all, quite a smooth experience.

View attachment 3560950

But wait, there's more! This being Tesla, I fully expected something to go wrong, and... well, wasn't disappointed. Or was, I'm still not sure.

After the ranger set off, I fiddled around with the menus for a moment, then realized it won't do much until I take it on a longer-ish calibration drive (needs ~20km to self-calibrate all cameras on the new hardware, before all the AP stuff becomes available again), and set off. Then realized it's still the middle of the day and I actually need to get back to work - so quickly came back, parked the car, and wanted to get something out of the glovebox.

Which wouldn't open.

For those who don't know - the glovebox in the Model 3 has no actual handle. It's opened by an actuator, controlled by a button on the screen. Which I pressed, and instead of the usual "click" and the glovebox slowly dropping open, heard a weird short electric "bzz" noise from the general area.

Troubleshooting time! Knock on the glovebox cover a few times - no effect. Try actuating it while pushing on it - no effect. Reset the screen and try again ("Hello, IT, have you tried turning it off and on again?") - no effect.

Ok, fuck this. Called Tesla, to their credit only took me about 3 minutes to get through to an actual person in the service center. Explained the problem. They called the ranger dude, he didn't really get far yet - came back half an hour later, and diagnosed the problem after taking half the dash apart again.

Apparently Tesla uses a ton of the same exact plug for many, many functions of the car - lights, some of the speakers, some actuators. Among those are the glovebox actuator, and the backup speaker that sits below the glovebox and is used for various alert sounds when the main speakers can't be used for some reason (for example, if the screen has crashed and is rebooting - which doesn't really happen much at all, but apparently was enough of a concern for a backup hardware solution to be in place? idk). Which he apparently swapped during reassembly after installing the FSD computer, which sits behind the glovebox.

Thankfully, once diagnosed, the fix took all of 5 minutes. Thanked him for his time, and he took off again. I decided that I'm not going back to work again at this point, and took off on a longer test drive to make sure the rest of the car actually all works :D

From what I can tell, it does. The camera calibration took about 15km, and after that the left side of my screen shows a ton more stuff than before: lane markings now include any arrows painted in the lane, there's stop signs, speed signs, traffic lines and stopping lines, cones, posts, trash bins... the stuff it has seen before (other cars/bikes/people, lane markings) seems to also be a bit smoother. Reversing and side cameras show up much faster when opened (sometimes took a couple seconds to render on the old hardware, and the side cameras always took a moment after the "main" one - now it's all pretty much instantaneous), and the image processing is better, so the picture of all 3 cameras appears to be a better quality than before. Dashcam/Sentry recordings should be better now, too - need to make a couple tests some time later. Halting at stop signs and lights works as promised. Not yet sure I'll keep that activated though, need to test it a bit more - you _do_ need to confirm every green light to be green, or it will slow down and stop as if it were red when Autopilot is active, which may become tedious after a while.

Sounds to me like the the plugs are not color coded or labeled... :/
 

D-Fence

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Yup, those plugs normally should be geometrically or colour wise made to match only the socket they need. But hey.

How much did that upgrade set you back or is stuff like this included?
 

leviathan

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Yeah, I wondered about the plugs too. He said it rarely happens, mostly because in most cases the software will raise an alarm if something is plugged in wrong - this one pair being switched is apparently a rare exception. Still, I agree - color code or at the very least clearly label the damn things...
How much did that upgrade set you back or is stuff like this included?
This was included at no cost, since my car had the FSD option from the beginning. Which I technically didn't even order - I ordered the car with EAP (Enhanced Autopilot, which was the top "on-the-menu" option at the time), but got upgraded to FSD because they changed the pricing between my order and delivery.
 

NooDle

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Heh. In my mind this was a simple OTA update since most of the hardware is already there. Interesting
 

leviathan

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Heh. In my mind this was a simple OTA update since most of the hardware is already there. Interesting
For cars built after March 2019, it is. That's when they transitioned from the old Nvidia-based "HW2.5" Autopilot computer to their own design "HW3" FSD computer in production - since then all cars come with the new one pre-installed, independent of software. Cars that had the FSD software option from before all get the FSD computer retrofitted - this has been done for Model S and X customers already, and has been happening with early Model 3s worldwirde for a while now, but Germany only now got the retrofit approved and hardware delivered to service centers.
 

eizbaer

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Should've just used one of those things that open when you press against it, like you have with certain cabinets... that way, there's no handle messing up your aesthetics and it's still a mechanical solution... ugh. Can't imagine the electronic solution really is cheaper, the actuator can't be that cheap. Same goes for the stupid door handles, really - those also suck balls!

regarding the issue with the same connectors being used: seems to be a similar issue... more of the same tends to be cheaper, so it may have been a cost-cutting measure to just use all the same connectors everywhere. in the end though, it turns around to bite them in the ass, as you're probably far from the first with the issue (also pointed towards by the fact that they rather quickly knew what was up).
 

leviathan

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This is an incredibly stupid design. What's wrong with a mechanical latch?
I think it was touted as "pre-designing" for the future "robot taxi fleet" concept, so the glovebox would remain locked when someone else and not the owner is using the car. It already stays locked in Valet mode, and you can also set a PIN that needs entering on the screen before it opens.

Which of course could all be done as an electronic lock in addition to a normal mechanical handle. Same as the interior door buttons - I have nothing against the external handles (except that they need explaining to literally every new passenger), but the interior buttons instead of handles are just plain unexplicable to me.
 

Perc

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It probably saves Tesla and other manufacturers a ton of money to put everything in a touchscreen instead of engineering a bunch of switchgear with the right look and feel.

General Motors did it particularly brilliantly on my car - the only buttons on the HVAC panel you ever use (temp, seat heater) are on laggy touch controls. All the other features are on well made buttons but you never ever touch them because that's what auto mode is for.
 
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