Toyota and Sports cars and the US

Hatmouse

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I've been looking around for some time now as to whether Toyota sells anything fun in the US, and know that at some point it had the Supra, Celica and MR2. A quick look on Toyota's US website shows none of those cars, though.

So do they really make anything fun for the US market anymore? Sorry if this has been asked already.
 

jeffy777

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Their minivans are a blast if you have kids :lol:

But the Land Cruiser is fun, but not the kind of fun you're thinking of.
 

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Re: Toyota and Sports cars and the US

FATMOUSE said:
I've been looking around for some time now as to whether Toyota sells anything fun in the US, and know that at some point it had the Supra, Celica and MR2. A quick look on Toyota's US website shows none of those cars, though.

So do they really make anything fun for the US market anymore? Sorry if this has been asked already.
The Prius. Watching your fuel economy figures is a gas.
 

p0w3r

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toyota is supposed to make a new car soon that would be a proper sportscar, but untill then, all toyota has is the scion tc which basically replaced the celica. (and honestly, it doesnt do any justice).

however, lexus has a new IS that is supposed to be very good and powerful if you get the IS350. However, that model only comes in automatic.

so to answer your question...i guess toyota doesnt have any fun car on the market for the us anymore. :?
 

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Re: Toyota and Sports cars and the US

FATMOUSE said:
I've been looking around for some time now as to whether Toyota sells anything fun in the US, and know that at some point it had the Supra, Celica and MR2. A quick look on Toyota's US website shows none of those cars, though.

So do they really make anything fun for the US market anymore? Sorry if this has been asked already.
its not just the US market.. its the WORLD!
Toyota has taken the fall in the sportscar marked to the ekstrem, and stoped all together..
the fun will come back... but you have to wait
 

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p0w3r said:
however, lexus has a new IS that is supposed to be very good and powerful if you get the IS350. However, that model only comes in automatic.


Yeah, but you can't compare and IS to an MR2 in terms of fun for price.

Maybe...MAYBE, you can say the Scion Tc is a toyota sports car in drag, but I dunno who would hop on that train.
 

Danny Tran

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I do know exactly what you're on about. Toyota use to have such charismatic cars including the mid-engined MR2, the Supra, Corolla GT-S (AE86) from 1983-1985, and the 4WD Celica. So much nostalgia..... :cry: Fortunately, tuners are keeping the spirit of these cars alive.

For example, the Supra is the car of choice if you want a dragster. It is frequent to see them achieve 500+ hp numbers.

Last year, the last generations of Celica and MR2 (not my cup of tea as for a sports cars go) were dropped. Today, the last remenants are composed of that scion metionned above and the Corolla XRS, which has the 2ZZ-GE (same engine as Celica and USDM Lotus). We also get the Matrix XRS but it is very poor combination of engine and chassis.

Fans of the Supra keep hearing about a comeback in the near future but Toyota but these are only rumors.

With its current direction of Toyotas trying to becom the number one manufacturer in the world and its hybrid conquest i doubt any super sports car will be emerging at least for a while.

If you care, the new Lexus IS350 looks like an interesting car: direct-injection 3.5l V6, the best V6 in its class. I have yet to test-drive it, but as far as Lexi go (plural of lexus), they are very conservative and the most reliable of all.

:|
 

GraemeH

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There's a new 200mph+ Lexus supercar on the way remember.

What they ought to be doing is bringing a MkV Supra to the market to compete with the 350z and the RX8 that their rivals are selling in decent numbers.

The only thing is people like me would be way too critical of it not living up to everything the MkIV was/is.
 

Danny Tran

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^^ Agreed. The 350Z is breaking record sales. Furthermore, the aftermarket for those is booming.

Cant say the same for Mazda's RX-8. No modding. potential whatsoever.

STi also has quite alot of aftermarkey parts.. but I'm not a fan.

I think we can say the sports coup? above 30,000 US$ segment is completely empty and exploitable.

We need some TVRs... :cry:
 

zenkidori

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Just FYI, the RX8 was the top selling RWD car in Japan in 2004.

The aftermarket for the 8 is HUGE. There are at least 4 turbo kits for it, and a new supercharger kit, along with normal NA tuning. also, tons of suspension and body bits. The 8 is a great sportscar, with a better chassis and suspension than the FD3S, it just lacks the power of the 7. The 8 was never meant to be a 7 replacement, and it does well in it's own right.

I think the best approach to tuning the 8 is in the suspension and lightness. The FEED 8 took the touge 300 class on best motoring, with only 200HP, that's quite a feat.
 

Danny Tran

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Sorry, forgot to mention I was talking about the US market as far as US sales go of the 350Z.

It is my understanding that the top of the line JDM RX-8 is slightly more powerful than the USDM version and a bit lighter too. Last dyno numbers i saw for the 8 were below 190 whp.

I guess it's due to the renesis' unconventionality that tuners have yet to come out with many kits and due to the fact it is still sort of new and oweners arent ready to sacrifice their warranties.

I just wish it were a bit faster.

I have to agree about the RX-8 chassis though. It it incredible and no where near as nice to drive on a course as the 350Z, which feels more of a gran tourer/cruiser. (*puts-on flame suit*)

How much lighter did you see we could make the 8 be?
 

pfrocker

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yep toyota at the moment is a family type company
there only fun car is the Lexus IS and the scion series for teenagers (personally I'm not too fond of the scion series), and they recently dropped both the mr2 and celica models
but there are rumors of the return of supra
I hope the bring back the celica and mr2 back too, but with better engines and styling
 

zenkidori

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rotary stuff is very plentiful, you just need to look in different places. there are tuners in japan with loads of parts to offer.

Japanese cars are lighter than ours because of added safety equiptment we require, so you can start there. weight reduction depends on your wallet, and how far you want to go, but I think it could be made considerably lighter.

The Mazdaspeed version should be released, right before they come out with the new 7!
 

Danny Tran

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Is the new RX-7 official? What are the specs for the Mazdaspeed 8? Whats your source?

Despite the RX-8 having an awesome chassis, I cant help but compare it to the S2000 (AP2 = 2.2L): Not only are the engine torque and power curves are about the same but the S2000 is much lighter, more reliable, doesnt drown, doesnt drink oil, has more modification potential (power and reliability) in North America.
 

zenkidori

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the MS 8 is still just a development platform officially, but it's been to every major car show mazda has been involved with for a while. it's got tuned body, interior and suspension, along with a supercharged renesis.

reliability hasn't been proven either way with either car. I don't know of any flooding issues with the 8 and the engine is supposed to use a small amount of oil, and it doesn't use much. you still never have to refill it between oil changes. also a comparison with the S2000 isn't exactly fair, as the 8 isn't supposed to compete with it or even share the same market niche. the S2000 is a roadster with only two seats and little space for anything else, of course it's going to be lighter. Also don't underestimate the mighty 1.3L rotary, big power numbers are easy with the 13B series engines, and more people are looking into porting thier engines, but still, I don't believe power should be central to any tuning scheme of the 8.

the 7 has never been official, but mazda engineers and industry people keep talking about it, or another "true rotary sportscar".
 

Danny Tran

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Mmm... with this mere "talking" about a future RX-7, I doubt it will come any time soon. In relation to the RX-8, the RX-Evolv was talked about and seen many years before actually came out.

I know about the 13B's potential, but the reliability issues are discouraging me from getting involved with an FD. :? Also, that stupid 90 degree bend in the exhaust manifold looks like a terrible design flaw and outright pisses me off. Do you think supercharging the only way to go for the renesis? Was is only designed to run in its naturally aspirated fomat?

I guess I'm gonna have to wait for the RX-8 community to experiment. Like I said, reliability is an issue for me.

On the side though, knowing how Mazda engineers its chassis, I have to say I would love to have a Kabura.
 

zenkidori

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In relation to the RX-8, the RX-Evolv was talked about and seen many years before actually came out.
Of course, and it was thought to be the new RX-7 as well. There are numerous projects going on at Mazda that point very strongly at the development of a new RX-7.

I know about the 13B's potential, but the reliability issues are discouraging me from getting involved with an FD. :? Also, that stupid 90 degree bend in the exhaust manifold looks like a terrible design flaw and outright pisses me off. Do you think supercharging the only way to go for the renesis? Was is only designed to run in its naturally aspirated fomat?
The reliability issues come from people not knowing WTF they are doing when tuning. Besides, you try and get a 1.3L piston engine to make 600HP reliably. For every single person who knows what they are doing with the 13B, there are 10 more who don't. If they rotary was so unreliable and horrible, they wouldn't be so popular in Japan(the FD sold up untill 2002). Also, the Naturally aspirated rotary engines are far more reliable than a piston engine. Many NA rotary racing teams rebuild thier engines once a season, instead of once a race.

I don't see why you could care about a bend in the exhaust, why wouldn't you replace it anyway? Exhaust gains huge power with rotaries, a buddy of mine gaind a full 65HP from a full 3" HKS with cast manifold and proper tuning.

The renesis was indeed built for NA, it was also given the engine of the year award when it came out. The reason that supercharging is better than turbocharging for the 8(in a few tuner's opinions and mine) is the exhaust port design. It's been changed from peripheral to side port, like the intake ports. The P-port exhaust allows us to spin very large turbos quite fast with our little 13BTs. A turbo that wouldn't be out of place under the hood of a supra or skyline does great with our comparativly tiny engines. With the side port design it saves on emissions and mileage, but doesn't flow as well as the older design. You could indeed P-port the exhaust, but that's a pretty big modification. There are a few other differences besides this, but that's a big one.

From the outside, the rotary can seem kinda scary, but once you realize it's stacked like legos and has like 3 moving parts it's a little less daunting. There are communities all over with people offering different tuning philosophies, from reliability to all out power. Down in AU they have some CRAZY rotary powered cars. It's just a different scene than the honda/nissan stuff, so you just gotta look in different places.
 

Danny Tran

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Thank you,

I'm looking to do a modest and completely reliable gains, say no more than 350hp.

Do you have any suggestions as where to start?

Btw, what kind of supercharger are you talking about?
 

AutoMX

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It seems toyota and honda are going for the cheap, reliable, economic, and mainly boring cars for the near future. We'll probably see the sporty bunch come back at some point but I honnestly couldn't care less. I'm still driving in the 80's (look at my sig if you don't get it)
 
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