UK Cops hate Honda Drivers, find excuse to blow one up in London

Plissken

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Apparently not only do British citizens lose all rational thought when suspected terrorism is involved, but British terrorists lose all parking ability when terrorism is involved.

Look, I agree with what you are saying. However, as Cobol74 says, the extremist sections of the IRA have woke up again and they have prior in using vehicles illegally parked to blow up city centres. The police, who are stupidly twitchy at the best of times, now have a reason to be even more hair trigger.

It doesn't excuse the actions of the police, but it does explain them.

However, Mr Civic Type R didn't take any of this into account when he decided to be a selfish fucking idiot. He got his car trashed. Good. Lesson is: if you don't want to be thought of as a selfish fucking idiot, try not being a selfish fucking idiot.
 

Dogbert

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Well, now that's what I find interesting. What makes Mr. Civic a selfish fucking idiot? Don't you think that's a bit... you know, strong?

A hasty parking job not only makes you a selfish fucking idiot, but is deserving of your car being crushed? I thought epp_b was exaggerating a bit when he talked about the UK's "unhealthy fetish for minor traffic infractions", but it appears not.


And, oh by the way, of the seven links Cobol74 posted, only two of them had to do with car bombs... and both were about the same incident. And that incident was about a car that drove through a barrier at a police station.
 

Plissken

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Well, now that's what I find interesting. What makes Mr. Civic a selfish fucking idiot? Don't you think that's a bit... you know, strong?

Maybe :)

Selfish because he quite clearly believes that parking restrictions are for other people.

An idiot because he didn't stop to think about the consequences of his actions, because they all apply to other people and not him. Those restrictions are there for a reason, not least the inconvenience caused by people who are trying to drive down that road but find their way blocked by an illegally parked car.

And "fucking" because... well, it sounds nice.

Losing his car is OTT, but I guarantee you he won't do it again.

Reminds me of the girl who consistently parked halfway down our road (one car wide, cul-de-sac) because she thought that walking 20 yards was for other people and who never gave a flying one about those further down the cul-de-sac who can't get out.

She found out the hard way when there was a small fire at the end of the cul-de-sac and the fire engine smashed her car out of the way to get to it.

I think they even gave her the bill for repairs to the fire engine.
 
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Peter3hg

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A car parked right outside the White House. Illegally. Not blowing up or being blown up.

That car is parked 3 times the distance from the Whitehouse than this car was.

Not blowing up some innocent guy's car and making a media debacle out of something, for starters.


Honestly, I don't know how you Brits aren't understanding this concept. It's not exactly a radical line of thinking.

It doesn't matter what they say on the phone, unless it's "yes, that's my car, and yes, I'm coming to move it right now". If that isn't the exact answer they get on the phone, or the car comes up anything less than clean... by all means, they should treat it as dangerous. But to bypass a simple record check just because of some knee-jerk reaction to OMG TERRORISM is just sloppy. I'd expect more from "the best anti-terrorism force in the world", frankly.

You act as though it would be beyond a terrorist to lie. How long do you wait for the person to turn up? Can you imagine the headlines if it was a bomb? "Half of London blown up while stupid police wait for terrorist to collect his car"

It's even more unbelievable how any rational thinking or simple fact-checking is all of a sudden acceptable to bypass when the perceived threat of terrorism is involved.

The "simple fact-checking" would achieve nothing. Wasting time is ridiculous. Chances are his mobile number would not be registered in a way that is connected to the car anyway.


I would also like to point out that there was a mortar attack on Downing Street in 1991 by a van parked in the exact same location. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downing_Street_mortar_attack


So a car parked illegally, the day before Remembrance Sunday parade, on the route of the parade, outside the front door of the Ministry of Defence, about a tenth of a mile from 10 Downing Street, on the site of a former bomb attack, and you still think it is an excessive response?
 

Top Geek

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that van was illegally parked. Manchester, June 1996. Largest bomb ever exploded on the mainland.
So, one incedent and suddenly all illegally-parked cars are suspect and should be blown to kingdom come? Bullocks.
 

Dr_Q

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It may also be worth noting that two years ago two cars laden with explosives and nails were left in busy areas of London and luckily were found. One of these was parked illegally and was actually towed away because of this, it was only at the impound that they found out it was absolutely crammed full of explosives.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Sky-News-Archive/Article/20080641272910

Given this recent history I feel that what the police did was extreme but by no means wrong. I'd much prefer to read this article about someone having their badly parked car blown up than witness accounts of a horrific car bombing because the police chanced it.
 

TC

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So, one incedent and suddenly all illegally-parked cars are suspect and should be blown to kingdom come? Bullocks.

:lol: I was thinking the same thing. Of all the illegally parked cars in the country, how many were rigged with bombs? I'm assuming a very small percentage.
 

shad_68

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So, one incedent and suddenly all illegally-parked cars are suspect and should be blown to kingdom come? Bullocks.

Yeah, because one incident means that suddenly all illegally-parked cars are being blown to kingdom come?

:lol: I was thinking the same thing. Of all the illegally parked cars in the country, how many were rigged with bombs? I'm assuming a very small percentage.

And how many illegally parked cars were blown up exactly again?
 

yeeha

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That car is parked 3 times the distance from the Whitehouse than this car was.

That was just one car google's camera happened to catch. Do you really think no one has ever parked illegally close to the white house or any other important building in the US? As far as I'm aware police in the US have never blown up a car suspected of being a car bomb just because it was parked illegally and poor timing.

I can understand why UK police took action based on the history there but I don't think that is how it would have played out in the US.
 

narf

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That car is parked 3 times the distance from the Whitehouse than this car was.

That's about as close as regular cars can get. Try to go closer and you're confronted with one of these: http://maps.google.de/?ie=UTF8&hq=&...d=eItgtJDGtziY7EPKcY2tLw&cbp=12,96.73,,0,6.91




Judging by the bomb setup for the WTC (mostly urea nitrate fertilizer), blowing up that car would easily trigger the bomb.




http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Sky-News-Archive/Article/20080641272910

Given this recent history I feel that what the police did was extreme but by no means wrong.

So you approve of blowing up a car loaded with petrol and gas canisters instead of further investigation?
 
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Peter3hg

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So you approve of blowing up a car loaded with petrol and gas canisters instead of further investigation?

As before, you really need to find out what a controlled explosion is. Look how little damage the Civic has sustained after two of these controlled explosions. A vehicle needs to be made safe to be investigated. A controlled explosion is the normal way of doing this.

1108266
 

Dr_Q

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So you approve of blowing up a car loaded with petrol and gas canisters instead of further investigation?

Also nails, don't forget the nails!

I'm still under the impression that controlled explosions and the bomb actually going off are two completely separate things. A controlled explosion should still leave the evidence intact.

I'm not debating that this is a nanny state or not because it evidently is, I just happen to side with the police on this particular issue. My Honda Civic was in London just 24 hours ago and didn't even get blown up once, having said that it isn't the new one or a Type R or parked illegally. I'm evidently doin' it wrong :(.
 

narf

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As before, you really need to find out what a controlled explosion is. Look how little damage the Civic has sustained after two of these controlled explosions. A vehicle needs to be made safe to be investigated. A controlled explosion is the normal way of doing this.

1108266

You already posted that image :lol:




Tell me, what is a "controlled explosion" supposed to do? For example to an IED made up of a fuse, urea nitrate and some other components much like the WTC bombing. Keeping in mind that there obviously was no in-depth investigation of the car, else they'd have seen that there was no bomb.

Controlled explosions for example of WW2 bombs in Germany usually involve a very small charge to remove the igniter from the bomb itself... for that you need to find the igniter (and thus the bomb) first though.



PS: Look, a huge van *really* close to number ten, still no explosion! Can't believe that's a legal parking spot, and terrorists should have no trouble putting some yellow light on top of their bomb van. http://maps.google.de/maps?f=q&sour...3Eu8rqAnj2vZDHYOlwiQmg&cbp=12,330.99,,0,20.84
 
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Peter3hg

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You already posted that image :lol:




Tell me, what is a "controlled explosion" supposed to do? For example to an IED made up of a fuse, urea nitrate and some other components much like the WTC bombing. Keeping in mind that there obviously was no in-depth investigation of the car, else they'd have seen that there was no bomb.

Controlled explosions for example of WW2 bombs in Germany usually involve a very small charge to remove the igniter from the bomb itself... for that you need to find the igniter (and thus the bomb) first though.



PS: Look, a huge van *really* close to number ten, still no explosion! Can't believe that's a legal parking spot, and terrorists should have no trouble putting some yellow light on top of their bomb van. http://maps.google.de/maps?f=q&sour...3Eu8rqAnj2vZDHYOlwiQmg&cbp=12,330.99,,0,20.84

The van is clearly to do with the building works and will have police clearance to be there.
I have no idea what precisely they did but clearly it wasn't anything major due to the state of the car. I was in Koln-Bonn airport when they carried out a controlled explosion on an abandoned suitcase, and it was a minute explosion. I imagine this would be very similar.
 

Dogbert

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I was in Koln-Bonn airport when they carried out a controlled explosion on an abandoned suitcase, and it was a minute explosion. I imagine this would be very similar.
It was; probably because there were no explosives in either case. ;)

So you approve of blowing up a car loaded with petrol and gas canisters instead of further investigation?
That's a really good point; how did they even know a controlled explosion would neutralize the suspected car bomb in the first place? Had these same anti-terrorism cops found the OK City, WTC, or Omagh car bombs, they would have just blown everyone up.

And doesn't the "best anti-terrorism force in the world" have bomb sniffing dogs? Where were they during all of this?
 

Dr_Q

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"Controlled explosion" is a misleading term, according to one former bomb disposal expert, who refuses to be named. It was coined when, in Northern Ireland, controlled explosions were actual explosions. "These days, the term bomb disposal units use is 'disruption' - trying to make sure the device can't function as it was intended to," he says. The most common method is to fire a "slug" of water (about a mugful) into the suspect package from a device similar to a shotgun. "The skill comes in identifying the relevant components and getting access to them."

The water, fired at high velocity, will blow the bomb's components - wires, circuitry, detonating mechanism - apart from within, without setting it off. "The water preserves forensic evidence as much as possible, unlike a high explosive, which will just blow it to bits." The procedure can be carried out by remote-controlled robots, called "wheelbarrows", which are also fitted with cameras, and can be operated from 100 metres away.

Source
 

narf

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"The skill comes in identifying the relevant components and getting access to them."

If they used this method here this means a skillful bomb technician must have identified the relevant components in a non-existent bomb.
 

Dogbert

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That's all well and good, but implies:

1. There was no explosion. Which there was. Two of them, actually.

2. They knew where a bomb was to target an aforementioned 'disruption'. Which they didn't.
 
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