Bin Laden dead

I am not trying to advocate the use of torture by my post. However I do believe my question is a legitimate one. The true is that Bin Laden was captured using information gathered from individuals who were tortured while in U.S. custody. Does that matter?
 
First of all, i don't see the connection being as clear-cut as the journalist makes it out to be. The newest data in the WikiLeaks files is a year old by now, so the impact of the testimony by the Guantanamo inmates has been but one small piece of the puzzle, after all, it took them another year or longer to get hold of Bin Laden.

Second, i don't think that a mere symbolic act like capturing Bin Laden justifies torture. Actually, i think that torture is never justified. Not even Jack Bauer-style torture to save millions from certain death in a terrorist act is justified. Because if we start to decided for whom the very values that make up our community ("community" in this case refers to "the western democracies") are valid and for whom they don't apply we destroy the very foundation of our community, or at least the people doing so lose any right to act in the name of said community, as not respecting the very values that make up the community removes them from it.
 
Jacobfox said:
Honestly can't blame P. Chidambaram. Pakistan has been incredibly uncooperative vis a vis the 26/11 attacks and has even blamed India for them. Another big terrorist hiding in plain sight in Pakistan gives them a really good chance for an "I told you so" moment.
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Oh I totally agree that Pakistan needs to bear the full brunt of the blame for allowing bin Laden the ability to hide within their country... I just don't think it is a very well time comment by P. Chidambaram. The world's leaders are congratuating the US Special Forces and applauding the removal of an evil man from this Earth, while India is pointing its finger at a long time rival.
 
It was filmed, we need the footage. The conspiracy theorists will go nuts otherwise.
 
Aston Martin said:
It was filmed, we need the footage. The conspiracy theorists will go nuts otherwise.
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It had to have been filmed. Even if it wasn't for official purposes, someone on the team had to have thought before hand "this is probably something I should get on tape." And there are certainly a lot of us that want to see that footage.
 
jetsetter said:
I know that some of you are adamantly against torture. How does the above make you feel?
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Just because it gets results doesn't make it right. Starvation? No problem, kill of excess population.

(I'm exaggerating for effect here but the logic is sound.)

Also although its all very nice that we've rid the world of this guy I can't help but feel the team used to take out the elderly bearded guy could have been put to better use elsewhere. This is nothing more than a moral booster really, as a single person Osama didn't really have any power.

Also its very hard to get a clear view on what exactly went on, I'd not be surprised if he has been dead for a considerable amount of time already. Time will tell I suppose.
 
What's the caption on that photo? Is this the gang watching the firefight live?
 
That would seem kind of obvious, but still, no caption... according to this it look like it was the case.

By the way, Google's already got reviews up on Bin Laden's compound. :lol:

Located in cozy, quiet neighborhood. Interrupted only occasionally by machine gun fire. Lacking in ameneties, but an up and coming area. Handyman special. One satellite phone available with smoking bullet hole for comms back home. CIA helicoptors offering complimentary air lift service for corpses. Great property to get away from it all. Must See!
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For a good second I was wondering why John Lithgow was in that picture... I also like to imagine that Hilary Clinton was looking at porn that needed to be pixelated out of the image.



Edit: Weird....I was browsing through the pictures of revelers in Washington D.C. when I noticed a guy wearing a shirt from my high school (Booker T. Washington Hornets) here in Oklahoma.


https://pic.armedcats.net/c/cl/clockwerk/2011/05/02/haha.JPG
 
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Clockwerk said:
For a good second I was wondering why John Lithgow was in that picture... I also like to imagine that Hilary Clinton was looking at porn that needed to be pixelated out of the image.
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I thought I was seeing Ray Romano in the back for a moment, but now that you mention it, Lithgow can't be unseen.
 
I read through a lot of drivel on my Facebook news-feed today, but this comment topped them all:
I kept thinking that this man will never know the love and truth Jesus could've brought 2 his life.
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Did I explain to this person that this kind of fundamentalist religious thinking is what a lot of terrorism is based on? No. I simply deleted her from my friendlist, since I realized the futility of the task and I have no desire to be associated with such people.
 
Buktu said:
What it all boils down to, is that people are celebrating the death of an enemy. How is that different from what we've in the Middle East?
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Celebrations in Middle East after 9/11 = Celebrating the murder of thousands of innocent people

US celebrations after Bin Laden's Death = Celebrating the death of the one grabasstic piece of amphibian shit that orchestrated the above murder.
 
Story in relation to that picture from Fox News
It was a nearly decade-long search to bring justice to America's number one enemy and the Obama White House knew there was no room for mistakes.

After months of planning, and weeks of intensified meetings, the president and his most senior counter-terrorism aides gathered in the White House situation room Sunday to observe the operation to capture or kill Usama bin Laden as it unfolded.

???"[W]e were able to monitor on a real-time basis the progress of the operation from its commencement to its time on target, to the extraction of the remains, and to then the egress off of the target," Obama's Homeland Security and Counter-terrorism Advisor John Brennan told the press at a White House briefing Monday.


President Obama and his national security team monitor the operation which resulted in the killing of terrorist Usama bin Laden. Their expressions say it all. (White House photo)

Administration officials refused to detail exactly what they meant by that other than to say there were some sort of visuals and other information that allowed officials to keep track of the situation continually.

"It was probably one of the most anxiety-filled periods of time, I think, in the lives of the people who were assembled here yesterday. The minutes passed like days."

Tension and silence filled the room.

Then, the pay-off.

Mission commanders uttered the phrase: "Geronimo E-KIA". "Geronimo" was the mission code name for Usama Bin Laden. "E" stands for "enemy." "KIA" is, of course, "killed in action".

Obama remained calm, sources say, even as those long-awaited words were spoken. There wasn't an "ah-ha" moment, Brennan says, when everyone realized spontaneously that the man killed was indeed bin Laden. The identification process was multi-faceted.

Then, as each piece came together, there was a growing sense of confidence that they'd gotten the right guy.

Finally, it became clear that the operation was a success and those carrying it out were safe.

President Obama's response said it all: "We got him."
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Link to the story

I am by no means an Obama supporter but i think this was handled well. Outstanding job by the "guys on the ground". we may never know thier names (barring any fucking WikiLeaks)
 
Gyvon said:
Celebrations in Middle East after 9/11 = Celebrating the murder of thousands of innocent people

US celebrations after Bin Laden's Death = Celebrating the death of the one grabasstic piece of amphibian shit that orchestrated the above murder.
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yea, i know, double post

the people that celebrated in the middle east may have been seeing the attacks on us as we are seeing the killing of OBL. Hell, they may view this incident as just the opposite. im not excusing in any way that the 2001 attacks were ok, im just explaining thier view.
 
Sik Pony said:
I am by no means an Obama supporter but i think this was handled well. Outstanding job by the "guys on the ground". we may never know thier names (barring any fucking WikiLeaks)
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Same here. As a Republican, I still gotta give Obama credit for this

Sik Pony said:
yea, i know, double post

the people that celebrated in the middle east may have been seeing the attacks on us as we are seeing the killing of OBL. Hell, they may view this incident as just the opposite. im not excusing in any way that the 2001 attacks were ok, im just explaining thier view.
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I see where you're coming from, and appreciate that you're taking the Devil's Advocate role here, but the fact remains that those people who celebrated the 9/11 attacks were still celebrating the deaths of people that did them no harm.
 
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