News: Bills would require license plate for all [bicycles], annual registration

[katwalk]

I actually recently got one but haven't had to use it yet as I haven't been driving much/anywhere new lately.

 

[narf]

No no no. I'm talking about a cyclist going the right way down a street. Car coming up behind to overtake, cyclist doesn't see the car and might stray into its path at the last moment (AFAIK mirrors are not required on bicycles here). If you are on a one way and cyclists are legally allowed to go the wrong way it means that he would see my car no matter what. On two ways its not a good idea to go against the traffic because that would complicate any maneuvers such as turning. Also lets face it they go really slow so I don't mind if they get some shortcuts legally as long as its not something stupid and obviously dangerous (to both cyclists and other users of the road).

The same problem you see in two way streets can happen in one way streets as well - when the bicycle goes in the correct direction and a car is coming from behind. The modus operandi is quite simple: The car leaves some space for the bicycle, the bicycle doesn't move left/right without making sure there's room, no matter how many ways the street goes.

After all, the car is overtaking the bicycle. Equal rights and duties to all and what have you, so the overtaker needs to make sure there is enough room for everyone while the overtakee does not make any sudden moves.

There are bicycles with electric motor assists now for going up hills they would be motor vehicles by any definition.

Electric bicycles that can run without pedal power or support the rider's pedal power at over 25km/h require an insurance plate over here. That serves both as proof of insurance and identification, operating without pedal input or motor support over 25km/h is where the German traffic laws draw the line between slightly assisted bicycle and moped/whatever.

 

[prizrak]

The same problem you see in two way streets can happen in one way streets as well - when the bicycle goes in the correct direction and a car is coming from behind. The modus operandi is quite simple: The car leaves some space for the bicycle, the bicycle doesn't move left/right without making sure there's room, no matter how many ways the street goes.

I think you forget what we talk about sometimes

I said that I am OK with a cyclist going wrong way on a one way because then I know they can see me. I didn't say going the same way on the one way wouldn't have been different.

I saw a cyclist almost get hit/fall off today. He was riding right in a car's blind spot on the left side of a multilane one way, no bike lane at all. The car indicated left and started turning so the cyclist swerved and almost fell over but recovered.

Now who do you think should be at fault here?

Electric bicycles that can run without pedal power or support the rider's pedal power at over 25km/h require an insurance plate over here. That serves both as proof of insurance and identification, operating without pedal input or motor support over 25km/h is where the German traffic laws draw the line between slightly assisted bicycle and moped/whatever.

AFAIK electric assisted bicycles are treated like regular bicycles here. You can buy em at Best Buy around here....

 

[Average Guy]

Personally I think this sounds extremely stupid. I know I'm only 16, don't drive a car and so on but come on! A license plate on a freaking bicycle?
And then it has to have a safety check and all these things?! All that costs more that the damn bike it self! It's not a 2 ton car we are talking about its a 10kg bike. It's limited how big damage it can do on other things than the person riding it.

And then a license for driving it!?

The next thing is a license for using rollerblades!

 

[MadCat360]

Personally I think this sounds extremely stupid. I know I'm only 16, don't drive a car and so on but come on! A license plate on a freaking bicycle?
And then it has to have a safety check and all these things?! All that costs more that the damn bike it self! It's not a 2 ton car we are talking about its a 10kg bike. It's limited how big damage it can do on other things than the person riding it.

And then a license for driving it!?

The next thing is a license for using rollerblades!

Exactly, you're talking about a 10kg vehicle sharing the roads with 1400kg vehicles. The 10kg vehicle operator needs to know what the fuck he's doing, otherwise he's getting clobbered.

I witnessed a man on a bike running a red light today. He nearly got run over by an SUV. This was in a suburban neighborhood. I think it's safe to say he was fairly oblivious, both of the laws he's supposed to abide by and of other traffic.

 

[prizrak]

Personally I think this sounds extremely stupid. I know I'm only 16, don't drive a car and so on but come on! A license plate on a freaking bicycle?
And then it has to have a safety check and all these things?! All that costs more that the damn bike it self! It's not a 2 ton car we are talking about its a 10kg bike. It's limited how big damage it can do on other things than the person riding it.

And then a license for driving it!?

The next thing is a license for using rollerblades!

Seems to work for the Swiss...

 

[lip]

The vehicle weight or size argument is silly, because it's the main fact that you are on the road and too you have to follow the same rules as the cars.

Furthermore here in Switzerland:
Once a year every school class under the 6. Grade has one day when they have to do a mandatory test: They have to drive a long course on the road trough the whole town. After every intersection or different part they get stopped by the police and the ones that did this part well can drive on, but the ones who failed or are too insecure have to do that section again. - Result: A very steep learning curve.

 

[prizrak]

Learned something the other day. Apparently in Soviet Russia bicycles had to be registered and if you were caught w/o a reg they took away your bicycle...

 

[narf]

Learned something the other day. Apparently in Soviet Russia bicycles had to be registered and if you were caught w/o a reg they took away your bicycle...

Registering bicycles would fit well into Obama's communist agenda?

 

[Cobol74]

Learned something the other day. Apparently in Soviet Russia bicycles had to be registered and if you were caught w/o a reg they took away your bicycle...

Rember that not absolutely everything in Soviet Russia was pants - good for them.

 

[prizrak]

Registering bicycles would fit well into Obama's communist agenda?

More like Andrew Cuomo (current governor of NY)

Rember that not absolutely everything in Soviet Russia was pants - good for them.

Strangely enough good things did come from them, go figure... Not sure if its still the case though.

 

[lip]

Here in Switzerland we have mandatory bicyle liability insurance.

You have to buy a vignette which you have to mount on your bicylce, just like a numberplate. Until 1990 it was an actual metal numberplate.
The vignette has a unique serial number and the main colour changes every year for better detecting of uninsured riders.
It costs 5 Swiss Franks and is valid for a year plus a bit of time into the following year.
To prevent theft of the vignette itself it is impossible to take the vignette off again without ripping it apart.
The insurance covers only the costs you cause on property of others, but not the damage on your own bike or yourself.

The fine for riding without a vignette is 40 Swiss Francs. And the swiss police is enforcing this very sharp. Which is a good thing.

Just bought a vignette "numberplate" today.
https://pic.armedcats.net/l/li/lipadier/2011/03/14/1_front.JPG

Damage cost is insured up to 2'000'000 SFR. Nice. This means I can now crash my bicycle into a Veyron SS, for example.
https://pic.armedcats.net/l/li/lipadier/2011/03/14/2_back.JPG

Slapped onto the bike. Good to go.
https://pic.armedcats.net/l/li/lipadier/2011/03/14/3_bike.JPG

Greetings, lip

 

[TestECull]

I wouldn't mind this requirement at all. Where I live there is no such thing as a bicycle lane and there is no such thing as a considerate cyclist.

a device to monitor speed,

...unless you're Lance Armstrong I doubt a speedometer is required on a bicycle. Besides the speedo in a good 50-60% of cars doesn't work.

Guys... they are bicycles. You know, the two-wheeled things with pedals that kids ride around on. I can honestly say that I've never had an issue with a cyclist on the road. Want to know why? Because I'm in a car and I can just pass them. Its really not a big deal, idk why everyone has their panties in a bunch over bikers. Hybrid drivers tend to annoy me much more than cyclists because they are always going under the speed limit, so why don't we start charging them more for registration? This proposal is nothing but a clear indication that someone has sand up their va-jay-jay. That video that you posted, Spectre - were you really that annoyed by that guy and his little girl? You're in a damn car, just pass them and move on with your life. Its not like they sat in the road right in front of you for 20 minutes while you couldn't get around them.

The scariest moment I've ever had when driving was when some dumb fucker on a bicycle cut infront of six thousand pounds of steel hurtling down the road at 45MPH. I may have pretty damn good binders but they can't break the laws of physics, and the steel front end on my whip is going to fuck someone's shit up. It predates pedestrian safety by quite a few years. That cyclist had no regard for his own safety and thought he owned the road.

Requiring a license and registration would have curbed that.

Believe me, they are worried about safety a lot more than you are in your 3000lbs metal shell.

Maybe in your area but here the fuckers are suicidal nine times out of ten. As I mentioned above some moron just darted out in front of a 25 year old Ford truck as if it could just stop on a dime. He's lucky I didn't lock up any tires when I firewalled the brake pedal because of his inconsiderate ass. Though on retrospective I probably would have been doing the world a favor if I kicked down a gear and smeared him, what's to stop him from doing that to someone who swerves into a tree and kills themselves?

What the f*ck business is it of yours what shape someone's bicycle is???? What, are you going to check their shoe soles next?

So by that logic I shouldn't have to fix the front end on my old truck. Who cares if the wheels fall off? Who cares if that failure sends a very heavy no-longer-controlled missile through a shop window? It's not their business what condition it's in!

I'm sure you'll spout off "Well bikes can't cause as much damage as your truck. They don't weigh anything". Which is true. But if that bike fails and the rider goes into traffic whatever was right behind him is going to suddenly change direction to avoid him. If that something is a city bus it's going to cause a LOT of damage before it comes to a stop. So ensuring a bicycle is mechanically sound makes as much safety sense as ensuring my truck is mechanically sound.

I would because its stupid and pointless. You seem to forget that if a cyclist runs a red light and you hit him, you get a scratch and he dies.

And then his family sues because nobody is able to take responsibility for their own actions in this country anymore.

How about we just build bicycle lanes then? I've biked through Boston before and it was definitely sketchy with all the cars around you but once you get onto a bike path, you are relatively safe.

Feasible in a few areas. But not mine.

The road in front of my house is pretty typical of the roads you encounter if you pick any direction and go for 10-15 miles. Two lanes about ten feet wide seperated by nothing more than two yellow lines painted into the middle, with startlingly deep ditches literally three inches from pavement's edge. In some places these ditches go down ten feet or more, with the average being about a foot and a half. If there isn't a ditch the woods run right up to the edge of the road. Vehicles with wide mirrors actually have to encroach in some spots to avoid having a tree rip the right hand mirror off!

There's nowhere to put the cycle lane. There's nowhere to go if they go stupid, either, you either smear the dumbass into the pavement or smear yourself into your steering wheel on that 250 year old oak tree six inches from the road surface.

 

[LeVeL]

Besides the speedo in a good 50-60% of cars doesn't work.

Source? I've known just one person whose speedometer didn't work.

Requiring a license and registration would have curbed that.

How? Licenses and registrations don't stop people from being retarded behind the wheel of a car, what makes you think that putting a sticker on some kid's bicycle will make a difference?

Maybe in your area but here the fuckers are suicidal nine times out of ten. As I mentioned above some moron just darted out in front of a 25 year old Ford truck as if it could just stop on a dime.

Again, not sure why you think that putting a sticker on a bike will miraculously solve this issue. Also not sure why you're so worried about your truck and its enormous bumper.

He's lucky I didn't lock up any tires when I firewalled the brake pedal because of his inconsiderate ass. Though on retrospective I probably would have been doing the world a favor if I kicked down a gear and smeared him, what's to stop him from doing that to someone who swerves into a tree and kills themselves?

Now you're just crossing the line into vehicular manslaughter. License plates or not, bad/stupid/crazy rider or not, I do not condone purposefully running some kid over.

So by that logic I shouldn't have to fix the front end on my old truck. Who cares if the wheels fall off? Who cares if that failure sends a very heavy no-longer-controlled missile through a shop window? It's not their business what condition it's in!

I'm sure you'll spout off "Well bikes can't cause as much damage as your truck. They don't weigh anything". Which is true. But if that bike fails and the rider goes into traffic whatever was right behind him is going to suddenly change direction to avoid him. If that something is a city bus it's going to cause a LOT of damage before it comes to a stop. So ensuring a bicycle is mechanically sound makes as much safety sense as ensuring my truck is mechanically sound.

And if the bus's wheel falls off as it swerves and if it crashes through the window of the Oval office and if a shard of glass stabs Obama in the eye and if he falls over screaming with pain onto the briefcase with the big red button and if the case if faulty and his hand goes through and hits said button then it will set off a nuke and the world will end. If someone falls off their bike and you swerve to avoid their now-rider-free bike without looking and hit another car then you shouldn't be driving.

And then his family sues because nobody is able to take responsibility for their own actions in this country anymore.

Right, let's pass stupid laws so that we don't have to face stupid lawsuits that we would almost certainly win anyways.

Feasible in a few areas. But not mine.

The road in front of my house is pretty typical of the roads you encounter if you pick any direction and go for 10-15 miles. Two lanes about ten feet wide seperated by nothing more than two yellow lines painted into the middle, with startlingly deep ditches literally three inches from pavement's edge. In some places these ditches go down ten feet or more, with the average being about a foot and a half. If there isn't a ditch the woods run right up to the edge of the road. Vehicles with wide mirrors actually have to encroach in some spots to avoid having a tree rip the right hand mirror off!

There's nowhere to put the cycle lane. There's nowhere to go if they go stupid, either, you either smear the dumbass into the pavement or smear yourself into your steering wheel on that 250 year old oak tree six inches from the road surface.

Sounds to me like you live out in the countryside. So I'm really not sure why its so difficult for you to go into the left lane and just pass mom, dad, and kid on their bicycles.

Seriously, you're making a huge deal out of something that you can just ignore and go on with your life.

 

[prizrak]

How? Licenses and registrations don't stop people from being retarded behind the wheel of a car, what makes you think that putting a sticker on some kid's bicycle will make a difference?

Again, not sure why you think that putting a sticker on a bike will miraculously solve this issue.

That argument works both ways though, if registration doesn't stop people from doing stupid shit there is no reason to register a car.

Honestly this is a simple issue of fairness under the law, if you are going to use public roads you should be subject to the same rules/regulations as other vehicles why should a bicycle be exempt when a scooter isn't? I mean they both weigh next to nothing and go about the same speed and neither would win against a car.

 

[TestECull]

Source? I've known just one person whose speedometer didn't work.

Then you don't know people with older cars. The only car I have access to that has an accurate speedo is my friend's brand new Fusion. My truck's speedo doesn't work at all, nor does the one in my aunt's '71 F100, my mom's is off by 3 or 4MPH, my dad's 5MPH slow, and my other friend's is either bouncing between thirty and sixty(In a '68 Mustang) or 5MPH fast(In a '95 Mustang). Now you may think an inaccurate speedo still works, but remember that the job of a speedo is to report the speed of the vehicle and if it's not accurate it's not reporting the speed of the vehicle. Erego, broken.

How? Licenses and registrations don't stop people from being retarded behind the wheel of a car, what makes you think that putting a sticker on some kid's bicycle will make a difference?

We're not trying to license kids off the road. We're trying to license suicidal adults off their bicycles. Having to buy a license will cause these derps to just give up on cycling entirely, and the ones that respect the road rules won't mind 15 smackers a year.

Again, not sure why you think that putting a sticker on a bike will miraculously solve this issue. Also not sure why you're so worried about your truck and its enormous bumper.

Firstly my bumper isn't that big. Go google my truck, you'll see exactly what this derp had barreling down at him. The danger is his head hitting the end of my hood, which would at that speed have shattered his helmet and then his skull. Secondly, I don't know about you but I don't feel like scraping moron out of my grille and living with the fact that I smeared someone. You may not have a conscience but I do, and the fact that the idiot deserved it and that I would be doing Natural Selection's bidding wouldn't be any consolation.

Now you're just crossing the line into vehicular manslaughter. License plates or not, bad/stupid/crazy rider or not, I do not condone purposefully running some kid over.

The derp was older than I am. Had to be in his 50's. Besides you've said several times that the guy in the car has nothing bad happen if there's a tangle with a bike, and regardless of which pedal is firewalled it's still vehicular manslaughter, so either you're a hypocrite or an idiot.


Pick one.

And if the bus's wheel falls off as it swerves and if it crashes through the window of the Oval office and if a shard of glass stabs Obama in the eye and if he falls over screaming with pain onto the briefcase with the big red button and if the case if faulty and his hand goes through and hits said button then it will set off a nuke and the world will end.

Now you're just being silly.

If someone falls off their bike and you swerve to avoid their now-rider-free bike without looking and hit another car then you shouldn't be driving.

It's not the bike they're swerving to avoid. It's the derp that didn't maintain the bike they're avoiding.


Though if it were me I'd avoid both. I have a $500 dollar vehicle so insurance sure as hell ain't paying for a new rad and AC condenser.

Right, let's pass stupid laws so that we don't have to face stupid lawsuits that we would almost certainly win anyways.

How 'bout instead we not deal with the lawsuits in the first place? HRM?!

Sounds to me like you live out in the countryside.

This is a truism. Nearest town is 15 miles to the west, if I go north south or east it's countryside for hours on end.

So I'm really not sure why its so difficult for you to go into the left lane and just pass mom, dad, and kid on their bicycles.

So you're the asshole that's in the wrong lane on blind hills/corners!

There's spots where you're stuck behind bicycles/tractors/whatever for a mile and a half because there is no safe place to go into the other lane and go around. Some derps, which I'm assuming you associate with based on your strange replies, don't seem to give a shit and indirectly make that bicycle more of a hazard than it really is.

Seriously, you're making a huge deal out of something that you can just ignore and go on with your life.

I can ignore cyclists that respect the rules of the road. They aren't a hazard to me, they aren't a hazard to themselves, and I have no problem following until it is safe to pass. What I can't ignore is the derps that think I can bend the laws of physics because their transportation hasn't changed in over a century.


...I'm getting the idea that you're just the type of road hazard that we want off the road. It's the only possible explanation for how vehemently you resist this.

 

[LeVeL]

Then you don't know people with older cars. The only car I have access to that has an accurate speedo is my friend's brand new Fusion. My truck's speedo doesn't work at all, nor does the one in my aunt's '71 F100, my mom's is off by 3 or 4MPH, my dad's 5MPH slow, and my other friend's is either bouncing between thirty and sixty(In a '68 Mustang) or 5MPH fast(In a '95 Mustang). Now you may think an inaccurate speedo still works, but remember that the job of a speedo is to report the speed of the vehicle and if it's not accurate it's not reporting the speed of the vehicle. Erego, broken.

My speedometer is off by ~3mph. It works, just off by a bit. I still know how fast I'm going.

We're not trying to license kids off the road. We're trying to license suicidal adults off their bicycles.

So you think that "suicidal adults" will not be able to pay "15 smackers a year" and little kids will?

Having to buy a license will cause these derps to just give up on cycling entirely, and the ones that respect the road rules won't mind 15 smackers a year.

Agian, why would they stop cycling just because they have to pay a few bucks a year? Doesn't stop morons from buying cars, for example, and the fees are much higher there.

Firstly my bumper isn't that big. Go google my truck, you'll see exactly what this derp had barreling down at him. The danger is his head hitting the end of my hood, which would at that speed have shattered his helmet and then his skull. Secondly, I don't know about you but I don't feel like scraping moron out of my grille and living with the fact that I smeared someone. You may not have a conscience but I do, and the fact that the idiot deserved it and that I would be doing Natural Selection's bidding wouldn't be any consolation.

Who was it that said that he wished he had run a cyclist over instead of slowing down for him?

The derp was older than I am. Had to be in his 50's.

Relevant how? Would it have been different if he was 8 or 80?

Besides you've said several times that the guy in the car has nothing bad happen if there's a tangle with a bike, and regardless of which pedal is firewalled it's still vehicular manslaughter, so either you're a hypocrite or an idiot.

Why yes, trying to avoid a collision at all costs yet still hitting the poor chap is exactly the same as flooring the loud pedal and steering into him in the face of the law.

How 'bout instead we not deal with the lawsuits in the first place? HRM?!

Exactly what I said and made fun of in my post.

This is a truism. Nearest town is 15 miles to the west, if I go north south or east it's countryside for hours on end. So you're the asshole that's in the wrong lane on blind hills/corners!

Who said anything about blind hills or corners?

There's spots where you're stuck behind bicycles/tractors/whatever for a mile and a half because there is no safe place to go into the other lane and go around. Some derps, which I'm assuming you associate with based on your strange replies, don't seem to give a shit and indirectly make that bicycle more of a hazard than it really is.

A mile and a half? A whole two minutes of your life? Besides, a) I've never been stuck behind a bike for that long without an opportunity to safely pass, and b) if he is in the middle of the road or something and you really cant pass, that's what the horn is there for.

I can ignore cyclists that respect the rules of the road. They aren't a hazard to me, they aren't a hazard to themselves, and I have no problem following until it is safe to pass.

Great! It seems that we got that one out of the way. I agree, I also don't see the problem with waiting 15 seconds before having an opportunity to pass. As for bikers swerving in front of cars and whatnot - that happened to me just once. All I did was brake, cuss, and move on with my day.

...I'm getting the idea that you're just the type of road hazard that we want off the road. It's the only possible explanation for how vehemently you resist this.

I'm a hazard that you want off the road? What?? :?

 

[prizrak]

My speedometer is off by ~3mph. It works, just off by a bit. I still know how fast I'm going.

All civilian speedos are 3-5mph too optimistic that's normal. Also if you get aftermarket wheels of different size they will be off by more, this is normal and acceptable.

So you think that "suicidal adults" will not be able to pay "15 smackers a year" and little kids will?

Why do you keep bringing kids into this? Proposed law would not apply to kids, there are already laws in place for kids riding bicycles and they state they are not allowed to ride in traffic and have to stick to the sidewalk, this is not going to change (nor should it), this law is for adults riding in traffic.

A mile and a half? A whole two minutes of your life? Besides, a) I've never been stuck behind a bike for that long without an opportunity to safely pass, and b) if he is in the middle of the road or something and you really cant pass, that's what the horn is there for.

Not relevant, he is talking about completely different terrain here. I took a few drives in PA where you couldn't safely pass a cyclist if they were on the road. In my experience honking at a cyclist will piss them off to no end and they will be complete asshats on purpose. One tried to pick a fight with me when I honked (short beep) and I had a Buick at the time not sure what he was thinking.....

I'm a hazard that you want off the road? What??

Because your driving is way too limpwristed in that little gayata of yours

 

[Hatmouse]

The only thing a bicycle should be excused from (versus a motorcycle) is emissions - because obviously it doesn't have any.

This is actually a variable determined by several different factors, including the amount of Mexican cuisine in the rider's diet.

Anyways, as someone who bikes on the road a fair bit I'm all for this.

 

[techfire1]

Surely we need to be encouraging people to cycle, and stuff like this will just make it difficult for people, especially those who might just want to spontaniously dust off the old penny farthing every now and then.

Yeah you get a couple of dicks on bikes but they don't generally hold you up for long and i'd rather have to overtake a load of kids on bikes than greenies in their damn G-wizzes and Priuses

I haven't cycled for ages but I tend to just go on the pavement most of the time as it's a death trap on the road. Would rather crash into a pedestrian on the pavement than get hit by a twat in an X5