"Foreign" cars get vandalized in detroit area

yeah, USA "the land of the free", unless you buy a Japanese car, we'll slash your tyres

srsly, don't these people think that the car companies are atleast a LITTLE to blame? If they didn't make shitty cars, people would be buying them.

No. These idiots really believe that every car they ever produced was the best ever made and was truly world class. I kid you not.

As for the slashing... it is interesting to note that this took place in a state where the purchase of arms is greatly restricted.

Alright, with one side armed with baseball bats and the other side with guns, the fun can begin. Let's start the riots...

Honestly, am I the only one who got a very bad feeling while reading the posts in this thread? :blink:

Having been *in* a riot with a gun (defender), and the other side having baseball bats (looters), the guys with the guns win every time.


No. This has been building up for a long time. There's a large segment of the US population that feels they are "entitled" to various things with little or no labor given; there's a similarly sized segment that's very tired of having to pay for the little entitlement "darlings" and are getting to the point where they just won't take any more. Guess which one the unions are; guess which one I am.

The Wall Street Bailout may prove to be a catalyst for something *very* large and very destructive. I wouldn't be surprised to see a Taxpayer Revolt on April 15 this year.
 
Calm down mate :lol: We're all people.

Including the two assholes that did this?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vincent_Chin

Yeah. Right. You vandalize the car I've spent ten years waiting/collecting/building, or you decide I'd make a good punching bag just because you lost your job for poor performance, you just resigned your membership as a "people".

I will happily welcome you into your new status of "imminent threat" with some 230 grain greeting cards. And it's legal where I live.
 
Last edited:
Including the two assholes that did this?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vincent_Chin

Yeah. Right. You vandalize the car I've spent ten years waiting/collecting/building, or you decide I'd make a good punching bag, you just resigned your membership as a "people".

Well ok I haven't paid much attention to the quote you were replying to, I admit. No, these are not.
The thing I was talking about is that because this happened once in how many - at least 36 years if not more - you're going to carry your loaded handgun around and suspect a killer in every black person. You have to be aware of things, but not paranoid. Most people can not resolve any sort of problem with a firearm, normally they end up in deeper shit. So probably not the best option.

Edit: and before someone makes a point, being trainted how to handle a firearm and knowing when, how, and, most importantly, if to use it are two entirely different things.
 
Last edited:
Um... you must be a Brit.

This has happened more than once. The Vincent Chin incident is the most widely covered, though. If you bother to read the thread, others have pointed out that this went on and still goes on. And will probably get worse in UAW-dominated areas.

A killer in every black person? Um, who's projecting here? In fact, black people in Texas are very law abiding on the whole, even the ones who appear to be thugs and gangsters. In fact, of the times I have been accosted on the street in America (not just Texas), most (several, perhaps a dozen) were white or Hispanic, one was Asian and only two were black. The last time I was in London, five people attempted to mug me, two people tried to pickpocket me, and one lunatic chased me up onto the sidewalk with a Ka. I found London to be a much more dangerous place than America, and I couldn't carry a weapon for self-defense.

I have carried a firearm for much of my adult life. I have used one a number of times in self defense (merely presenting the firearm often ends situations without a single shot being fired), and I have shot a car thief who refused my order to surrender and went for his back pocket. Turns out he had a gun, and he had decided that he wasn't going back to jail - so he'd kill any witnesses or anyone who accosted him. I shot him when he was half in my parked Jag of the day while he was reaching for his back pocket. No charges were filed against me.

Funny thing about being "paranoid" per other people. Sometimes it's a real appreciation of the world around us and it's the person labelling you "paranoid" that's got their head up their ass.

Edit: and before someone makes a point, being trainted how to handle a firearm and knowing when, how, and, most importantly, if to use it are two entirely different things.

Oddly enough, before you can get a carry permit in the state of Texas, you must go through a short training program that is actually more rigorous than the ones the police go through at their academies. We are taught when, where, how to shoot, and more importantly, when NOT to shoot.
 
Last edited:
A killer in every black person? Um, who's projecting here? In fact, black people in Texas are very law abiding on the whole...
I was rather talking about the Detroit area, but nevermind.

In fact, of the times I have been accosted on the street in America (not just Texas), most (several, perhaps a dozen) were white or Hispanic, one was Asian and only two were black. The last time I was in London, five people attempted to mug me, two people tried to pickpocket me, and one lunatic chased me up onto the sidewalk with a Ka.

Wow you sure are one hell of a magnet for trouble :lol: Are you sure you're not wearing a "fuck you all" t-shirt of sorts? :lol:

I have carried a firearm for much of my adult life. I have used one a number of times in self defense...

Oddly enough, before you can get a carry permit in the state of Texas, you must go through a short training program that is actually more rigorous than the ones the police go through at their academies. We are taught when, where, how to shoot, and more importantly, when NOT to shoot.
Well fair enough then, I'm not the person to lecture you in any way. Ok thanks for explaining :)
 
It is legal to shoot a person who is vandalizing or attempting to vandalize your car in Texas.

For some strange reason, we don't have a lot of car vandalism. I can't imagine why.

It's perfectly legal to do the same in California. "You just have to drag them in your house and put a knife in their hand."* ;)




*This is an actual quote from an LAPD cop
 
And then pray that the LAPD doesn't care enough to send out a forensic examiner. :p

Here in Texas, not so much...
 
Reminds me of "Don't buy from the Jews". Hitler did that.

Seriously, looks like some people need a good beating down there......
 
In fact, of the times I have been accosted on the street in America (not just Texas), most (several, perhaps a dozen) were white or Hispanic, one was Asian and only two were black. The last time I was in London, five people attempted to mug me, two people tried to pickpocket me, and one lunatic chased me up onto the sidewalk with a Ka. I found London to be a much more dangerous place than America, and I couldn't carry a weapon for self-defense.

Would you be terribly surprised, if I told you that I was never robbed, chased or tried to be mugged in my entire life? And I have been to several big cities. Apart from some reckless bicycle riders, I have never felt like being in danger - not even at night. My cars have never been stolen, broken into or vandalized.

Now, it could have something to do with the fact that I'm 6'3" and not exactly on the slim side and that I have always lived in a fairly peaceful area but mainly I think it has something to do with living in a relatively safe society, where social conflicts, racial conflicts or poverty aren't nearly as dramatic, as on the other side of the Atlantic.

Considering this, I always felt that with everyone carrying a gun in the USA to be able to shoot a petty thief, if necessary, it is only fighting the symptons, while ignoring the underlying disease...

To me a constitutional state is a state which has the monopoly on violence, where a criminal has to be brought to justice by the state in the shape of a court and a judge - no matter what.

If a state allows its citizens to take justice into their own hands, for example by sanctioning lynch law (let's call it by name), it has forfeit the right to be called a constitutional state in my eyes.

Single civilians shouldn't be allowed to take justice into their own hands. It is a contradiction to everything I call civilized. And I pity those who think it is the only way to defend themselves, because in that case something obviously has gone completely wrong in their society.
 
Last edited:
To me a constitutional state is a state which has the monopoly on violence, where a criminal has to be brought to justice by the state in the shape of a court and a judge - no matter what.

If a state allows its citizens to take justice into their own hands, for example by sanctioning lynch law (let's call it by name), it has forfeit the right to be called a constitutional state in my eyes.

Single civilians shouldn't be allowed to take justice into their own hands. It is a contradiction to everything I call civilized. And I pity those who think it is the only way to defend themselves, because in that case something obviously has gone completely wrong in their society.

I can think of about six million reasons why what you have just proposed is a bad idea.

13 March 1938: Nazis pass Weapons Act "Waffengesetz", enabling total gun registration and confiscation in Germany. All in the name of "justice" and "domestic peace" and "civil rule".

8 Nov 1938: The government begins disarming the Jews.

11 Nov 1938: This is promulgated:

Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons
11 November 1938
With a basis in ?31 of the Weapons Law of 18 March 1938 (Reichsgesetzblatt I, p.265), Article III of the Law on the Reunification of Austria with Germany of 13 March 1938 (Reichsgesetzblatt I, p. 237), and ?9 of the F?hrer and Chancellor's decree on the administration of the Sudeten-German districts of 1 October 1938 (Reichsgesetzblatt I, p 1331) are the following ordered:

?1
Jews (?5 of the First Regulations of the German Citizenship Law of 14 November 1935, Reichsgesetzblatt I, p. 1333) are prohibited from acquiring, possessing, and carrying firearms and ammunition, as well as truncheons or stabbing weapons. Those now possessing weapons and ammunition are at once to turn them over to the local police authority.

?2
Firearms and ammunition found in a Jew's possession will be forfeited to the government without compensation.

?3
The Minister of the Interior may make exceptions to the Prohibition in ?1 for Jews who are foreign nationals. He can entrust other authorities with this power.

?4
Whoever willfully or negligently violates the provisions of ?1 will be punished with imprisonment and a fine. In especially severe cases of deliberate violations, the punishment is imprisonment in a penitentiary for up to five years.

?5
For the implementation of this regulation, the Minister of the Interior waives the necessary legal and administrative provisions.

?6
This regulation is valid in the state of Austria and in the Sudeten-German districts.

Berlin, 11 November 1938
Minister of the Interior
Frick

I think we all know what happened next.

So, what do you think those six million Jews were thinking when they were being rounded up by the Germans? Do you think they were thanking YHWH that they lived in a state with a monopoly on violence? Or do you think they were wishing they'd not supported the Weimar gun restrictions that started this whole mess; and that they'd had a gun to defend themselves from the state agents that came to collect them?

I believe you will find your answer in the Warsaw Ghettos. About 1000 Jews armed with mostly civilian and improvised weapons held off the mighty Wehrmacht and SS for THREE WEEKS.

If you look through recent history, you will find it rife with examples of the state taking the monopoly on violence and then turning on the people it is supposed to serve. At best, the state takes the monopoly on violence and then promptly punishes those it does nothing to save for doing nothing but saving themselves. Or do you believe this was justice?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Martin_(farmer)

We don't carry guns to shoot petty thieves; that's not the primary reason. The primary reason we carry guns is to protect ourselves from deadly threats to ourselves and others.

Puzzle for you: If the state has the monopoly on violence in a "civilized country", like I'm sure you consider most European states, why do the police there feel they need to carry fully-automatic submachine guns to protect themselves? After all, won't the state protect them? Won't the threat of a trial and prison keep the police from being harmed? If not, why not? And if the police, who are specially protected by law, and who can't be everywhere at once, feel that *they* need submachineguns to protect themselves from what goes on in the world, why is that any different than the average citizen's position?
 
Last edited:
Ever heard of Godwins Law?
 
Yes, and I hate having to use the Nazi comparison.

On the other hand, I *am* talking to a German and in order to use an example he'd be familiar with, well.... There's kind of a limit as to what I can use. :p

Besides, he started it with his Unwarranted Cultural Superiority Syndrome. :p
 
I dunno.. there's a certain something to what he says. I'm American, but I gotta say I feel safer here in Germany than in the states, on the whole and whole. Although, the areas I usually stick to in the states are more upper class, and I haven't encountered too much there to make me fear my life.

On the other hand, when I'm in certain parts of Germany (yes, I'm looking east.....) I wouldn't mind being allowed to carry.
 
I dunno.. there's a certain something to what he says. I'm American, but I gotta say I feel safer here in Germany than in the states, on the whole and whole. Although, the areas I usually stick to in the states are more upper class, and I haven't encountered too much there to make me fear my life.

On the other hand, when I'm in certain parts of Germany (yes, I'm looking east.....) I wouldn't mind being allowed to carry.

And to be honest, most of the places I go in the US I don't need a firearm either.

On the other hand, I do transport sensitive materials, large amounts of cash, go to less than savory neighborhoods at odd hours, etc., etc. - all as part of my job and the IT contracts I've been paid to do.

And we've also seen that even in an otherwise "safe" area, one may have need of a firearm - see Appalachian School of Law shooting and the Pearl, MS incident among others.
 
In what country do the police carry 'fully-automatic submachine guns' on normal duty?

Airport cops in most European countries carry submachineguns. In addition, the Italian carabinieri are quite famous for their Beretta SMGs. The Brits have deployed "armed response teams" with H&K MP5 SMGs around London in roaming vans.

In addition, the Glock 18 fully-automatic machine pistol (SMG in all but name, size, and appearance) is quite popular in Europe and is seen in many continental police holsters. It is easily distinguished from the Glock 17 or 19 by the round rotary mode switch on the left side of the slide:

800px-Glock18c_01-1-.jpg
 
Last edited:
3: As far as you know:
I) How many firearms are there in the USA?
There are an estimated 200 million guns in the USA as of 2007 Source: Small Arms Survey 2007, Graduate Institute of International Studies, Geneva, Switzerland.
II) How many people are killed with firearms each year in the USA?
The latest statistics I can find are from 2005: 12,352 people were killed with firearms that year. Source: CDC [link]
III) How many people defend themselves with firearms each year in the USA?
A 1993 survey showed that while there were 4000 gun related murders, 2.5 million crimes wre prevented through use of firearms.Source: 1993 survey by Gary Kleck, Florida State University criminologist. His findings were cited by the Supreme Court in their DC v. Heller decision.

4: As far as you know:
I) What kinds of weapons are used most often by criminals in the USA?
Criminals usually use small-calibre handguns, ex. .25 ACP, .32 ACP .380 ACP, etc...Source: US Department of Justice
II) How easy is it to get fully-automatic firearms/machine guns in the USA? Are they even legal?
Machine guns are legal in all but 8 states. Since the 1934 Act they've been heavily restricted, and no new machine guns can be imported or made for private ownership. In order to legally acquire a machine gun you need to be 21 years of age, do some ATF paperwork, and pay a $200 transfer tax. Also, since no new machine guns can come into private ownership, existing ones demand an exorbant amount of money (ex. a low-end automatic M11/9 sells usually sells for around $4000, whereas an automatic M16 is usually $15000.)
III) How often are machine guns used in crimes?
Legally owned machine guns have been used in two murders since the 1934 NFA act, and one was by a policeman who stole the weapon from his PD armoury. Another 8 crimes were committed related to machineguns, but these were trivial crimes such as failing to notify the ATF of an address changeSource: Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms


something out of my friend Jon's journal
 
Yeah... McDonalds (heart disease), doctors (medical malpractice), automobile accidents, and home accidents all kill more people in the US than firearms do - by a significant margin.
 
Top