It seems that TRIANGLE POWER has failed Mazda!

[un-dee]

Its easy. If I buy the car I pay tax for 1309cc, so it has 1309cc.

 

[bone]

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/rotary-engine2.htm

The power delivery in a rotary engine is also smoother. Because each combustion event lasts through 90 degrees of the rotor's rotation, and the output shaft spins three revolutions for each revolution of the rotor, each combustion event lasts through 270 degrees of the output shaft's rotation. This means that a single-rotor engine delivers power for three-quarters of each revolution of the output shaft. Compare this to a single-cylinder piston engine, in which combustion occurs during 180 degrees out of every two revolutions, or only a quarter of each revolution of the crankshaft (the output shaft of a piston engine).

you missunderstood that quote

Quote:
he output shaft spins three revolutions for each revolution of the rotor, each combustion event lasts through 270 degrees of the output shaft's rotation.


that means that for each rotation the rotor makes, the output shaft will have made 3
there still are 3 combustions for each rotor rotation, but the output shaft will have made 3 rotations over that period

and my question on which no one has been able to answer:
RPM on a rotary engine, is that output shaft rotation or rotor rotation?
_________________

 

[BlitzR]

RPM is usually taken from the flywheel.

 

[bone]

^so a 9K redline, only means 3K rotor rotations

that's actually not that much

 

[BlitzR]

Less work then the 4 stroke engine.

 

[MXM]

Well, piston engine doesn't really rotate at all

 

[BlitzR]

On the 4 stroke engine there is 1 power stroke for every two revolutions of the shaft. On the rotary there are 3 power strokes for every 1 revolution of the rotor which translates to 1 power stroke for every 1 revolution of the shaft.

 

[sandor_]

Hell I have been in an RX8 on the left lane of the autobahn before a few times as a passenger and nothing can match the exhilaration of revving that rotary wankel all the way upto 9000rpm.

mmmm, hitting 8400 rpm's in a GT3.

hitting 11,000 + rpms on a duc 996...

 

[Top Geek]

Having read this and the article on Autoblog, I've noticed this specific quote:

Mazda claims that the problem is brought on by hot climates or the usage of synthetic oil. If the oil is allowed into the combustion chamber, it eventually reaches the catalytic converter and causes a malfunction of that emissions-control device

If this is, indeed, the case, Mazda is walking a huge extra mile, because it's not even their fault. The rotory often fails because of social reasons, not technical. Basically, this means it's the owners' faults. Too many people expect to be able to maintain a wankel engine like they do any "normal" piston engine. Most RX-7 owner's I've talked to say that you need to use thicker grades of oil for hot weather, and thinner grades for winter. They also say that you should never use synthetic oil, because of it's resistance to burning off -- rotory engines purposely burn oil by design.

So, if they are telling the truth in that quote, I give major kudos to Mazda.

 

[sandor_]

Having read this and the article on Autoblog, I've noticed this specific quote:

Mazda claims that the problem is brought on by hot climates or the usage of synthetic oil. If the oil is allowed into the combustion chamber, it eventually reaches the catalytic converter and causes a malfunction of that emissions-control device

If this is, indeed, the case, Mazda is walking a huge extra mile, because it's not even their fault. The rotory often fails because of social reasons, not technical. Basically, this means it's the owners' faults. Too many people expect to be able to maintain a wankel engine like they do any "normal" piston engine. Most RX-7 owner's I've talked to say that you need to use thicker grades of oil for hot weather, and thinner grades for winter. They also say that you should never use synthetic oil, because of it's resistance to burning off -- rotory engines purposely burn oil by design.

So, if they are telling the truth in that quote, I give major kudos to Mazda.

or mazda didn't tell owners (via the manual) these little tidbits of information, such as not using synthetic oils...

and if the problem is brought on due to hot climates, well, that is ENTIRELY on mazda., since they are the ones choosing to sell cars in those locations, without (most likely) warning the buyers that where they live will greatly affect engine longevity.

 

[Top Geek]

or mazda didn't tell owners (via the manual) these little tidbits of information, such as not using synthetic oils...

and if the problem is brought on due to hot climates, well, that is ENTIRELY on mazda., since they are the ones choosing to sell cars in those locations, without (most likely) warning the buyers that where they live will greatly affect engine longevity.

How many people actually read their manuals?

 

[Clown]

you missunderstood that quote

I don't misunderstand shit. Come back when you have a bit on mechanical knowledge.

 

[sandor_]

or mazda didn't tell owners (via the manual) these little tidbits of information, such as not using synthetic oils...

and if the problem is brought on due to hot climates, well, that is ENTIRELY on mazda., since they are the ones choosing to sell cars in those locations, without (most likely) warning the buyers that where they live will greatly affect engine longevity.

How many people actually read their manuals?

cover to cover, every vehicle i own. usually read the entire haynes manual too, and try to get a hold of a factory service manual.

 

[Peter3hg]

or mazda didn't tell owners (via the manual) these little tidbits of information, such as not using synthetic oils...

and if the problem is brought on due to hot climates, well, that is ENTIRELY on mazda., since they are the ones choosing to sell cars in those locations, without (most likely) warning the buyers that where they live will greatly affect engine longevity.

How many people actually read their manuals?

cover to cover, every vehicle i own. usually read the entire haynes manual too, and try to get a hold of a factory service manual.

Your no real man! I have never ever read a manual for anything, I just fiddle till things do what I want.

 

[Top Geek]

Your no real man! I have never ever read a manual for anything, I just fiddle till things do what I want.

 

[sandor_]

or mazda didn't tell owners (via the manual) these little tidbits of information, such as not using synthetic oils...

and if the problem is brought on due to hot climates, well, that is ENTIRELY on mazda., since they are the ones choosing to sell cars in those locations, without (most likely) warning the buyers that where they live will greatly affect engine longevity.

How many people actually read their manuals?

cover to cover, every vehicle i own. usually read the entire haynes manual too, and try to get a hold of a factory service manual.

Your no real man! I have never ever read a manual for anything, I just fiddle till things do what I want.

... but i thought the li-thp and weekly manicures already identified what type of man i am!

 

[Redliner]

or mazda didn't tell owners (via the manual) these little tidbits of information, such as not using synthetic oils...

and if the problem is brought on due to hot climates, well, that is ENTIRELY on mazda., since they are the ones choosing to sell cars in those locations, without (most likely) warning the buyers that where they live will greatly affect engine longevity.

How many people actually read their manuals?

cover to cover, every vehicle i own. usually read the entire haynes manual too, and try to get a hold of a factory service manual.

Me too!
I read all the manuals of all the things I buy (and have a manual)

 

[Jay]

I find it funny how people defend the rotary engine on the fact that it is 1.3 liter displacement.

*coughcough2.6literscoughcough*

you're an idiot.

I will post a picture of a cookie if you can even tell me why people even try to argue that .

How very rude. From what I have read, It equals out to 2.6 liters. I found info online from various sources, and the data seemed credible, so I stuck with it.

Calling me an idiot was a poor choice of words. "Ignorant" is more appropriate, wouldnt you think?

 

[kaBOOMn]

Japanese car companies have a reputation for initiating recalls themselves, because they find something out or something doesn't work as expected, unlike some other companies who wait to get sued a few times to initiate a recall.

Look what happened to Mitsubishi in Japan...please?

Also get it out of your head that Japanese built cars are totally reliable and things like say RB (for example) engines are unkillable :?

Enough on that.....sorry I don't want to start a low grade forum war

Still I think its sad that it came to this, still we where told for ages how the new RX8's engine would cure all the normal Wankel quibbles. Hrm.... I mean I admire Mazda for sticking their necks out but the Wankel?

On the sealing front (apex seals and piston rings) I suppose the piston ring has a easier life because it really does have less travel and less load placed on it, and you also have another compression ring (sometimes) and a oil ring with oil their wonderful bore cleaning/lubricating features.....

I really hope Mazda can fix the Wankel motor, its a unique thing but somehow it seems to be a lost cause....

Oh and there was a rumour that high oil useage was said to be a "feature" of Wankel motors.....this was stated in the owners manual of early RX8's. Can anybody confim/deny this?

 

[zenkidori]

The engine injects a small amount of oil into the combustion chamber to lubricate the apex seals and build compression. Indeed the engine will "eat" a bit of oil, but not such a huge amount that you'd need to worry about it if you got your oil changed properly and roughly on time.

Most modern piston engines have 3 rings, oil, intermediate and compression. They are subject to less forces than an apex seal, hence thier better ability to withstand detonation.