Covid 19 CRISIS

SirEdward said:
Why is South Korea not in the article from Forbes?

Or Israel. Or Australia. Or Austria. Or Czech Republic. Or Greece. Or Estonia.

Wouldn't that in the article be cherry picking, by any chance, only showing Countries that did well AND have a female PM?
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Not sure about the rest, but Austria screwed up a lot, e.g. the likely cover-up in the skiing resorts of Tyrol.
South Korea is missing, definitely.
 
narf said:
Not sure about the rest, but Austria screwed up a lot, e.g. the likely cover-up in the skiing resorts of Tyrol.
South Korea is missing, definitely.
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I looked up at the data and took a bunch of Countries that have roughly the same good data as Finland, for example, or comparable (or better) total deaths, daily new cases, cases for 1M people, official CFR than Denmark, AND have a male PM.

It turns out, a lot of them fall into comparable category by data only, including Austria.

The article cherry picked those with a female PM and mounted an argument saying that the Countries that responded best all have a female leadership.

Well, that's simply not true. But not just because male PM in Countries who responded good (or even better than the ones indicated in the article) exist; even because Belgium has a female PM and is a mess in Coronavirus terms (as in Spain levels of mess).
 
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I guess what would have to be done would be a per capita graph of countries infection and death rates average. Then plot countries above and below that number. There are more men leaders vs women leaders (21 by my count). Preliminary investigation shows yep countries with female leadership are disproportional below the average of infection and death rate. Now just because they are disproportionately better off doesn't mean that men cant be leaders only that they have performed worse than women in this particular crisis.

I want to apologize if i misunderstood that the agenda should be to prop up male dominance its obviously difficult to point to why when the numbers dont support it but I agree im not attracted to women either

LeVeL said:
Gender is a social construct, so how about we don't presume these persons' genders?
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Transmisogyny has guaranteed that all of these world heads of government are their expressed gender until after they leave office. This will be true until it isn't.
 
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Why are we talking about some silly opinion piece for nearly a page now?

There are so many factors in how well a country deals with this. I postulate than the fact that Angela Merkel is a scientist (Ph.D. in physics) has more influence on Germany's relative success than her being a woman. Taiwan's vice premier is a medical doctor who specialises in preventive medicine, and their minister for heatlh is a dentist by trade. Put people with actual scientific knowledge in charge and behold, they deal better with scientific facts than others.
 
narf said:
Because snowflakes feel triggered by this outrageously female opinion.
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REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE! :p

DanRoM said:
Why are we talking about some silly opinion piece for nearly a page now?

There are so many factors in how well a country deals with this. I postulate than the fact that Angela Merkel is a scientist (Ph.D. in physics) has more influence on Germany's relative success than her being a woman. Taiwan's vice premier is a medical doctor who specialises in preventive medicine, and their minister for heatlh is a dentist by trade. Put people with actual scientific knowledge in charge and behold, they deal better with scientific facts than others.
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Also, this. Now i want to read that opinion piece.
 
Momentum57 said:
I guess what would have to be done would be a per capita graph of countries infection and death rates average. Then plot countries above and below that number.
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I've done a quick check through the data, and I only took Europe, so to keep an area where the virus spread veeeeeery roughly at the same time and to still account for the highest number of Countries with a female PM.

I ranked them by death per million people, and I kept an eye on the cases per million people.

The worst off is Belgium, with a female PM.
Then, 10 Countries with a male PM.
Then Denmark and Germany, female PM.
Then Austria and Slovenia, male PM.
Then Norway, female.
Than Estonia, male.
Then Iceland, female.
Then Czech Republic and Hungary, male.
Then Finland, Moldova, Serbia, female.
Then another 11 Countries with a male PM.

As it turns out, the female leaders are good on average, but there doesn't seem to be a pattern on that matter.

The reality is there are a lot of reasons why a Country fared well or not: time of outbreak and to prepare countermeasures, travel connections, state of the healthcare system, education of the politicians, corruption levels, strength of the leadership, cultural norms, density of populations, even sheer luck.

It is quite obvious that "gender of the leader" is not really among those reasons.

narf said:
Because snowflakes feel triggered by this outrageously female opinion.
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It is actually a wrong opinion, and demonstrably so, as we have seen.
 
SirEdward said:
It is actually a wrong opinion, and demonstrably so, as we have seen.
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So far everyone's missed two main issues

First, "against the opinion piece": Correlation does not automatically imply causality.

Second, "for the opinion piece": Look past the gender aspects and read the actual points. Take the paragraph about Germany out of context, and it reads more like a praise of the scientific approach than the female approach (whatever that may be) - but it's a valid opinion:
Truth

Angela Merkel, the Chancellor of Germany, stood up early and calmly told her countrymen that this was a serious bug that would infect up to 70% of the population. “It’s serious,” she said, “take it seriously.” She did, so they did too. Testing began right from the get-go. Germany jumped right over the phases of denial, anger and disingenuousness we’ve seen elsewhere. The country’s numbers are far below its European neighbors, and there are signs it may be able to start loosening restrictions relatively soon.
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narf said:
So far everyone's missed two main issues

First, "against the opinion piece": Correlation does not automatically imply causality.
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Of course it doesn't, as it can clearly be shown.

The problem of the article is that the title is very specific (and wrong) and it shows the data have been cherry-picked to be able to sustain a wrong assumption (and a quite offensive and sexist one).

Second, "for the opinion piece": Look past the gender aspects and read the actual points. Take the paragraph about Germany out of context, and it reads more like a praise of the scientific approach than the female approach (whatever that may be) - but it's a valid opinion:
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You can't just take that part in an article titled in that way and with that first paragraph and say it praises the scientific approach (btw, it's not about the scientific approach, it's about jumping "right over the phases of denial, anger and disingenuousness we’ve seen elsewhere"), because in this way you are not taking into account the blatant assumption that this great characteristics would be something that enlightened women are teaching to a scared and angry old world of men. That's as much cherry-picking as the article does.

If truth and decisiveness (or jumping "right over the phases of denial, anger and disingenuousness we’ve seen elsewhere") are the important traits, those traits are not gendered.

They were not when brilliant women were suggested to go back to the kitchen, it is not now. That article is sexist.
 
narf said:
Not my problem if you choose to ignore the points made in the opinion piece and look past the clickbait.
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You are ignoring the fact that those points are being made to support a completely incorrect conclusion.
Imagine if the article said “nations lead by white people show better c19 outcomes” and used those same data points. Would you defend that article and validity of its points?
 
narf said:
Not my problem if you choose to ignore the points made in the opinion piece and look past the clickbait.
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It's your words, though.

But ok. look: (from the article)

"Generally, the empathy and care which all of these female leaders have communicated seems to come from an alternate universe than the one we have gotten used to. It’s like their arms are coming out of their videos to hold you close in a heart-felt and loving embrace."
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Who? Angela Merkel? Heart-felt and loving embrace? What the heck is the writer saying? Does the author live in a parallel universe?

I defended Merkel's truthfulness when she brutalized the immigrant girl by saying she would have to go back to her Country, years ago, so I can't be accused of hating Merkel. But heart-felt and loving, yeash, as a sphinx.

"Who knew leaders could sound like this?"
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Like leaders such as the pope (when he does stick to humanity) or Mandela don't (or didn't) exist...

"Now, compare these leaders and stories with the strongmen using the crisis to accelerate a terrifying trifecta of authoritarianism: blame-“others”, capture-the-judiciary, demonize-the-journalists, and blanket their country in I-will-never-retire darkness (Trump, Bolsonaro, Obrador, Modi, Duterte, Orban, Putin, Netanyahu…)."
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That is not representative of "males in leaders' roles", that is the scum of our world, people I have been harshly condemning for years, because their way is not "normal", it's wrong, deranged, violent and evidently so from the dawn of time.

Another way has always been possible, it's not like everybody thought that sh*t is the best you can get and has to stay forever unchanged.

And now a deluded writer tries to teach the world what is already clear?

BTW, Netanyahu and Orban, as bad as they are, are doing equal or better against the Coronavirus than most of those female leaders; I think that means that "authoritarianism" is not that much of a deciding factor in this matter, just as "gender" is not.

Trump has not failed because he is a horrendously arrogant -man-, but because he is as incompetent and delusional as a doorknob on lsd. Bolsonaro is not failing at takling coronavirus because he is an authoritarian machoist, he is failing because there is almost no single topic in which he can build up any functional solutions and because he is on a monumental power trip. Duterte will try to solve everything by killing people, even hot weather.

Seriously, learn to recognize a bad article, when you see one.
 
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